German tagged text?

[Ivano]

It would be great to have a chance to have some german bibles with tagged text. Any chance?

[Boris Repschinski]

When I talked with the people of the German bible society about this during the past SBL meeting in San Francisco, they said they don't have any plans to work on this. And this would be something that the Germans would have to work on, I guess.

[Helen Brown]

We'll be glad to assist any German speaker who wants to tackle such a project.

[Ruben Gomez]

I believe both Luther Bibel 1912 and Münchener New Testament (1998) are already tagged. Why not ask permission to use those?

[Helen Brown]

Ruben: please send me sources for these tagged texts.

[Chuck Schneider]

That would be nice.

[Johannes]

Where can we get those tagged german texts? Can those texts be imported like any other user bible?

[Helen Brown]

No, user Bibles do not support tagged texts of any kind, but if we can get a text and a license, we will be glad to make them available.

[Fabian]

No, user Bibles do not support tagged texts of any kind, but if we can get a text and a license, we will be glad to make them available.

O.K. Where are the fulfillment of that promises? I have sent you all what you need.

[Helen Brown]

We have not been able to secure licenses for most of the texts that you requested, or an etext with a clean provenance. It is not for lack of trying.

[Johannes]

Dear Helen, where exactly is the problem? Luther 1912 for example is public domain. The Menge-Bibel is also public domain (for the translator died in 1939).

 

And another question: Will you also offer the Leonberger Bibel in the Robinson-Pierpont-Version?

 

Thanks & Greetings from Germany!

[markusvonkaenel]

Hallo Johannes

 

Mangelndes Interesse oder Willen von Seiten Accordance. 

 

Deine Wünsche treffen auf taube Ohren in Florida. Wenn du deutsche Texte willst, gibt es heute eine bessere Software.

[Fabian]

Hallo Johannes

 

Mangelndes Interesse oder Willen von Seiten Accordance. 

 

Deine Wünsche treffen auf taube Ohren in Florida. Wenn du deutsche Texte willst, gibt es heute eine bessere Software.

Is leider wahr.

 

Grüsse

 

Fabian

[Fabian]

Dear Helen, where exactly is the problem? Luther 1912 for example is public domain. The Menge-Bibel is also public domain (for the translator died in 1939).

 

And another question: Will you also offer the Leonberger Bibel in the Robinson-Pierpont-Version?

 

Thanks & Greetings from Germany!

Yes the Luther 1912 is public domain but the Strong's tagging is © by https://www.importantia-publishing.nl. So I know the same as for the Louis Second 1910 avec Strong's. Which Accordance denied to add as a Bible, because of the royalites which is a shame. 

 

The Elberfelder 1905 mit Strong's is © by Johannes Runkel (Bibelkommentare.de), he wrote to me he had nothing heard from Accordance. 

 

For the German Schlachte 1951 OakTree has the rights. Also for the Strong's tagging. But they hadn't done the module. Yes I know the Schlachter 1951 from this tool is a little bit changed. So all Umlaut are in Ae, Ue, etc. or otherwise. And the numbers are in numerals than in words, or otherwise. but this is simply to change. With the compare function in Accordance you found the difference quite fast. Or I can send you the text where I have changed all the things so it is exactly like the Schlachter 1951 module from Accordance. The © holder asked me last year if the text is now in Accordance, unfortunately I have must negate. 

 

For the Münchner Neues Testament mit Anmerkungen, I have found just an old e-mail which the contact person for rights asked for contact to Accordance I have both contacted hopefully this will be included too. 

 

If nothing goes wrong there should also come the Elberfelder CSV mit Strong's Indizierung. 

 

For the Jantzen Neues Testament mit Anmerkungen had Accordance also got the text and the permission. Logos has it now included as BW had done too. I can give the e-mail if you want it again. 

 

With the Neue Einheitsübersetzung 2016/17 I don't know exactly, but I might there is an contract now. I had done what I can. I also asked the University to write an official letter to the Bibelwerk, because first they wrote to my they had no interest. 

 

For the other German Catholic Bible Herder Verlag, I know only they had interest to work with Accordance. 

 

For the Zunz Bibel, the publisher told me, when I was by him in the Store, he had interest to work with Accordance but they had to contact him. 

 

For the LXX.D LXX Deutsch the GBS wanted to bring it to Accordance but they won't. Now it is on the prepub list in Logos. I wonder who is faster, I vote for Logos.

 

For the Vulgata Deutsch https://www.projekt-vulgata.ch/Projekt-Vulgata/Startseite.htmlI don't know where the stand is. The https://www.projekt-vulgata.ch/Projekt-Vulgata/Startseite.html had invest a lot of time and money and they can't it give for free to Accordance. If I see the project manager the next time I will ask him.

 

So a lot want to work with Accordance, or are interested, but ...

 

Greetings

 

Fabian

Edited November 18, 2018 by Fabian

[Johannes]

Thank you, Fabian, for the full answer.

 

I don't want to blame Accordance. If the German market is not particularly interesting for them, we have to accept that. On the other hand, I would be happy if after many years of waiting a tagged German text would come out one day  ... (and maybe a good German-Greek dictionary, like the Bauer ;-)

 

And Logos is simply no alternative for me. I've been working with Accordance for over 10 years, and apart from the lack of German resources, I still consider it qualitatively superior to any Bible software.

 

So I would like to invite again all of you who have created German UserBibles or UserTools and want to share them, to send them to me so that I can publish them under accordancebible.de. I also set up a German twitter account just for fun: @AccordanceBibel :-)

 

Blessings from Germany!

[Fabian]

An addition to my post. 

 

Johannes Runkel, the © holder of the tagged Elberfelder 1905, don't want to give a permission, because the tagging is not good enough. But he told me the Elberfelder CSV with Strong's came out. Which he prefer. I told him, I know this and I'm contact with the project manager. 

 

Hopefully this Bible comes to Accordance with the Strong's tagging. Mr. Alexander vom Stein had done a tagging for this Bible but, this was not good enough for the CSV. So they invested over 2 years in an "brilliant" tagging. 

 

And it would be cool, if the second Leonberger NT comes to Accordance too.

 

I wrote years ago to the Gruyter Verlag about the Bauer Wörterbuch. They wrote back, they had then finished just right now the conversion to an e-text. Now on Logos it is on gathering interest.

 

Greetings

 

Fabian

[Fabian]

I don't want to blame Accordance. If the German market is not particularly interesting for them, we have to accept that. On the other hand, I would be happy if after many years of waiting a tagged German text would come out one day  ... (and maybe a good German-Greek dictionary, like the Bauer ;-)

 

I have thought I write a statement as I saw this blog entry https://www.accordancebible.com/Accordance-Training-In-The-Philippines. Now is the time.

 

It was a pleasure to read this blog entry from my perspective.Because it supports my wishes with almost every sentence, I try to find understanding in the OakTree management. Not only for German but also for other languages. 

 

Thanks

 

Greetings

 

Fabian

Edited November 24, 2018 by Fabian

[Johannes]

Wenn man das hört, kann man schon etwas „neidisch“ werden: https://theoblog.de/logos-8-im-gespraech-mit-benjamin-misja/32933/

 

By the way: Ron Kubsch, who is a famous german evangelical blogger (theoblog.de), (and me) wrote about Accordance and promoted it until Accordance 10 on websites and in a German evangelical magazine.

Edited December 4, 2018 by Johannes

[Fabian]

Wenn man das hört, kann man schon etwas „neidisch“ werden: https://theoblog.de/logos-8-im-gespraech-mit-benjamin-misja/32933/

 

By the way: Ron Kubsch, who is a famous german evangelical blogger (theoblog.de), (and me) wrote about Accordance and promoted it until Accordance 10 on websites and German in an evangelical magazine.

 

I know also another School in the German world who works since 2 years with L. Acc is on the dying branch in the German speaking world.

 

Greetings

 

Fabian

[Johannes]

We at Martin Bucer Seminary (MBS) still use and promote Accordance (accordancebible.de is currently supervised by Martin Bucer Seminary) - but that may change in the future when Logos simply offers a more comprehensive and appealing offering/product and a better support. Ron Kubsch is head of the MBS study centre in Munich. (Martin Bucer Seminary is the largest Evangelical Seminary in Europe outside of the UK, and as far as I know the largest in Germany, and it hast study centers all around the world - for example in Brasil and in India.)

Edited December 4, 2018 by Johannes

[markusvonkaenel]

Looking a bit deeper at their offer, I'm asking myself is it really worth to abandon Accordance because they are not offering more German tagged bible text, I would like to see eg Schlachter2000 with tagging. To be honest, for me I see no reason to change to Logos.

 

Like Accordance they offer mainly works in English and to buy again the same in Logos is a waste of money. And a lot of scientific works are only available in English. The same here and there with a similar price tag.

 

I have also to say, I read mainly Hebrew, prefer rabbinical stuff over other things so I'm no longer dependent on bible translations and the offerings of Logos or Accordance. Most of the commentaries, like Rashi, Rambam I do not expect to see in Accordance, here I have to go Bar Illan Responsa and Serfaria resp. real books. In Israel, fortunately, still a preferred method to learn and read. 

 

So what could be the recommendation of us German speakers to Accordance be, to give them a hint, how they could to survive in German speaking Europe?

Probably also a German speaking responsible Person here in Europe?

Edited December 6, 2018 by markusvonkaenel

[Unix]

Any of the following with an etext and/or an Accordance rep working from Germany/Austria:
Some ECF partial, well selected compromise, to scroll along English and Latin. IF there's no Latin currently under Accordance produce that too, any Edition

Brief Latin-German key just for commonly misunderstood words prone to otherwise enter hastily written papers
Some German Bible in print similar to the 1985 New Jerusalem Bible (whole) and Revised New Jerusalem Bible just New Testament portion (I won't use the OT of it), without notes. Is it also used by Protestants or will be if it would be one of the few or only recent German Bible with both OT and NT? I must apologise but I've read the Bible only in English for fifteen Years and am now at loss about pros and cons about different German Bible versions

Bauer Koiné Gk-German lexicon from etext with tagging added
A condensed Theological Hebrew-German dictionary whether transliterations or non-
Catholic Cathecism in German
A monograph that has Luther's moral standards, in German, deeper than populistic, if there's one from early 20th century just before or after WWI.
A German Bible dictionary.

Would this above be well prioritised? Later when a German language academic groundbreaking monograph comes out, if it's under a publisher with which Accordance has relationships and a voting system here on the forums or by email to German Accordance users lifts it to awareness levels, it should get produced here:

So what could be the recommendation of us German speakers to Accordance be, to give them a hint, how they could to survive in German speaking Europe?

Probably also a German speaking responsible Person here in Europe?

[Johannes]

Looking a bit deeper at their offer, I'm asking myself is it really worth to abandon Accordance because they are not offering more German tagged bible text, I would like to see eg Schlachter2000 with tagging. To be honest, for me I see no reason to change to Logos.

 

Like Accordance they offer mainly works in English and to buy again the same in Logos is a waste of money. And a lot of scientific works are only available in English. The same here and there with a similar price tag.

 

I have also to say, I read mainly Hebrew, prefer rabbinical stuff over other things so I'm no longer dependent on bible translations and the offerings of Logos or Accordance. Most of the commentaries, like Rashi, Rambam I do not expect to see in Accordance, here I have to go Bar Illan Responsa and Serfaria resp. real books. In Israel, fortunately, still a preferred method to learn and read. 

 

So what could be the recommendation of us German speakers to Accordance be, to give them a hint, how they could to survive in German speaking Europe?

Probably also a German speaking responsible Person here in Europe?

 

I don't want to switch from Accordance to Logos, too.

 

A few years ago, when I set up the website accordancebible.de (at that time still as an independent website), I got requests about Accordance from German-speaking users. At some point the maintenance of the site became too much for me. So at least then there was a lively interest in Accordance in the German-speaking area.

 

Logos currently offers almost 200 German resources. Among them are dictionaries like Bauer-Aland (in spring 2019), dogmatics like Wayne Grudem's (I could contact the publisher there) and commentaries. There are also biblical encyclopedias and the works of Luther or Bonhoeffer as well as Greek courses.

 

My wishes are much more modest: I would like a German tagged Bible text, the Bauer-Aland and maybe a German bible dictionary.

 

Beyond that it makes sense not only for the German-speaking area, but for all, who concern themselves scientifically with church history and dogmatics, to offer also the texts of people like Luther, Calvin, Bonhoeffer, Barth etc. in German (thus in the language, in which they were written).

 

But what is really interesting is what Accordance thinks? Is there interest in doing something for the German market, and if so, to what extent?

Edited December 8, 2018 by Johannes

[markusvonkaenel]

 

My wishes are much more modest: I would like a German tagged Bible text, the Bauer-Aland and maybe a German bible dictionary.

 

Beyond that it makes sense not only for the German-speaking area, but for all, who concern themselves scientifically with church history and dogmatics, to offer also the texts of people like Luther, Calvin, Bonhoeffer, Barth etc. in German (thus in the language, in which they were written).

 

But what is really interesting is what Accordance thinks? Is there interest in doing something for the German market, and if so, to what extent?

 

 

 I agree with your modes wishes.

 

Concerning the statement about church history, this was the reason a friend of mine learned German. So for those in theology an important point. BTW: this is not my cup of tea.

 

Lets see what accordance think resp. if they make a statement at all.

[MattChristianOT]

 I agree with your modes wishes.

 

Concerning the statement about church history, this was the reason a friend of mine learned German. So for those in theology an important point. BTW: this is not my cup of tea.

 

Lets see what accordance think resp. if they make a statement at all.

Many in my field publish in German. I would love this as well since the best way to learn German is to be immersed in it...