Jump to content


Photo

Let's talk lexicons and dictionaries.


  • Please log in to reply
18 replies to this topic

#1 davidmedina

davidmedina

    Gold

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 387 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:San Juan, Puerto Rico
  • Interests:God, my family, the Bible, photography and film.
  • Accordance Version:10.x

Posted 13 October 2013 - 01:34 PM

I am thinking of adding some dictionaries and lexicons to my Bible study collections and need some suggestion of what would be basic must have.

 

Right now I am considering Mounce's Expository Greek and Hebrew Dictionary as a basic one. 

 

Thanks


"Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect." Rom. 12:2
 
Blog: The Renewed Mind.

#2 JonathanHuber

JonathanHuber

    Platinum

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 718 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Englewood, CO
  • Interests:Bible study, Greek
  • Accordance Version:10.x

Posted 13 October 2013 - 03:18 PM

The suggestions would depend on what you have and what your goals are. BDAG and HALOT are the standard Greek/Hebrew lexicons, respectively. If you haven't studied the original languages, then Mounce's dictionary may be more helpful, but I don't have it and can't comment on it. The Anchor Yale Bible Dictionary is really a multivolume encyclopedia and is the standard scholarly english language dictionary. The IVP Essential collection is a great bundle that includes dictionaries specializing in different areas (like NT background or the Gospels) while also including the fantastic single-volume New Bible Dictionary, a couple of commentaries, and a bible atlas. The Eerdmans Bible Dictionary is another good single-volume dictionary, but it's included in any Accordance v10 package so you probably already have it.

 

If you could describe what you want to get out of the lexicon/dictionary, it would help folks here to make better recommendations. If you call Accordance, they can also provide some ideas of tools that can fit your goals and complement what you already have.



#3 davidmedina

davidmedina

    Gold

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 387 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:San Juan, Puerto Rico
  • Interests:God, my family, the Bible, photography and film.
  • Accordance Version:10.x

Posted 13 October 2013 - 03:40 PM

Good point.  

 

I am a newbie and not familiar with many/most of the resources available.

 

This is my situation. I already have logos 5 with a pretty large library (Portfolio) with some additional resources I have added on the side. I just bought the Bible Study Collection and added the IVP Essentials. But the Bible Study Collection is very bare bones. So every time I pick Accordance to study I find myself having to open Logos to access the resources there because I don't really have much with Accordance.  So I am thinking that at least I have to bring my Accordance to a level that I can actually use it without having to go to Logos that frequently. I think that with the IVP Essential and Tyndale I am fine, but it feels weak in Lexicons.

 

I looked into upgrading Accordance to the Essential Collection but other than the original language Bibles/ text it seems like the really good resources are sold as add-on and not part of any package. 

 

I want something that has more information and discusses the words more than what the Bible Study has which is basically definitions. My thinking on Mounce Expoxitory Dictionary is that is like a Vine's, concise but with more detail information than what I have right now in Accordance. What I am looking is for some others in the that line that compliment and enhance my Word Study. 

 

I am planning to get the BDAG/HALOT eventually (Christmas).


"Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect." Rom. 12:2
 
Blog: The Renewed Mind.

#4 Dan Francis

Dan Francis

    Platinum

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 557 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Alberta, Canada
  • Accordance Version:10.x

Posted 13 October 2013 - 03:46 PM

I find Mounce's dictionary a little too basic myself….

 

GK G1528 | S G1400, G1401   douvloß   doulos   126x

a male slave, or servant, of various degrees, Mt. 8:9, et al. freq.; a servitor, person of mean condition, Phil. 2:7; fem. dou/lh, a female slave; a handmaiden, Lk. 1:38, 48; Acts 2:18; douvloß, used figuratively, in a bad sense, one involved in moral or spiritual thraldom, Jn. 8:34; Rom. 6:17, 20; 1 Cor. 7:23; 2 Pet. 2:19; in a good sense, a devoted servant or minister, Acts 16:17; Rom. 1:1; one pledged or bound to serve, 1 Cor. 7:22; 2 Cor. 4:5 ˘ servant; slave.

±  MOUNCE | NIV | ESV | HCSB | NRSV | NKJV | KJV

 

Mounce, William D. Mounce Concise Greek-English Dictionary of the New Testament. Accordance electronic edition, version 3.0. Altamonte Springs: OakTree Software, 2011.

 

 

douvloß douélos [slave], su/ndouloß syéndoulos [fellow slave], dou/lh douéleœ [female  slave], douleu/w douleuéoœ [to be a slave], doulei÷a douleiía [slavery], doulo/w douloéoœ [to enslave],  katadoulo/w katadouloéoœ [to enslave], doulagwge÷w doulagoœgeéoœ [to enslave], ojfqalmodouli÷a ophthalmodouliía [eye-service]

 

douélos, syéndoulos, douéleœ, douleuéoœ, douleiía. All these words have  to do with slavery. In distinction from parallel groups, they denote compulsory service, oikeéteœs comes closest, but it stresses the social position of the slave, while douélos stresses dependence on the lord.

 

A. The Word Group among the Greeks.

 

1. Greeks have a strong sense of freedom. Personal dignity consists of freedom. There is thus a violent aversion to bondage. Service may be rendered to the state, but by free choice. Slavery is scorned and rejected. This explains the fierceness with which the Greeks fought for political independence. The only slavery Plato will allow is to the laws. The laws, however, represent the goal of humanity, so that slavery to law is in no way derogatory. Aristotle shows a similar scorn for slavery; for him slaves have no part in the state or true service to it. The Stoics have a broader view of service. Zeus himself summons us to it, so that, while free in relation to all people, we are unconditionally bound to all. Yet the Stoic would never call himself the douélos theoué; he moves through the world as basileués and despoéteœs, the very opposite of the douélos. This is the characteristic of the wise. Those who are not wise are slaves, no matter what the form of their bondage (cf. Epictetus, Plutarch, and Philo).

 

2. This survey shows that the group has no religious significance for the Greeks. It acquires this as Near Eastern religions win new adherents and in so doing change the Greek view of God and our relationship to him. The only apparent exceptions are in Euripides, but these are special instances, e.g., the need to yield to Dionysus, or Orestes’ evasion of responsibility by claiming that he is enslaved to the gods. In Greek religion the relationship to the gods is in general a family relationship in which Zeus is father of both gods and humans. Kneeling is no part of religious ceremonial for the Greeks except before chthonic deities, and here only for the sake of proximity. The worshipper is phiílos rather than douélos, so that it makes no sense to describe service of the gods, or life under the eyes of the gods, as douleiía.

 

B. The Word Group on Jewish Soil. In the Greek Bible, however, the group very largely crowds out the various parallels. The reason lies in its use for the root ‘bd.

 

1. The relation to this root shows that douélos emphatically denotes the slave and the status of slavery. Thus paiís is used for this root when the normal relationship of a slave is at issue, but douélos when the thought is that of the illegality and unreason of the service. The group then denotes Israel’s bondage in Egypt (Ex. 13:3; 14:5; Lev. 26:45, etc.). Jacob accepts the state of a douélos with Laban (Gen. 29:18). When one people falls subject to another, douleuéein is the proper word to describe it (Judg. 3:8; 1 Sam. 17:9). In contrast, paiís is the proper word in Is. 53 (The Servant of the Lord), since this service is rendered on the basis of an essential relation in the household.

 

2. Since the group denotes restrictive service, it is the proper term for the relation of ruler and subjects, for it expresses both the power demanded on the one side and the subjection and bondage experienced on the other. Saul’s courtiers are his douéloi in 1 Sam. 18:5, Joab is David’s douélos in 2 Sam. 14:9-10, and the whole people douleuéei the king in 1 Kgs. 12:7 (where Rehoboam himself is advised to be a douélos to the people in order the more surely to win their douleiía). An interesting point is that while subordinates use the terms about themselves, rulers do not describe the relationship by the group. An element of decision, whether voluntary or compulsory, is thus assumed.

 

3. The climax of development is reached when the group comes to be used for the relationship to God. This also involves the sharpest antithesis to Greek and Hellenistic thought. douleuéein in the LXX is the most common term for the service of God, not just in isolated acts, but in total commitment. The group may also be used for service of Baalim or other gods (Judg. 10:6, 13), but the only right thing for the elect people is exclusive service of the Lord (Judg. 10:16; Ps. 2:11, etc.). For this reason douéloi

 

is a title of honor when conferred on such outstanding figures as Moses (Josh. 14:7), Joshua (Judg, 2:8), Abraham (Ps. 105:42), David (Ps. 89:3), and Jacob (representing Israel, Is. 48:20). The opposite of douleuéein is disobedience.

 

4. The Jewish world shares this view of divine service with other Near Eastern peoples, among all of whom the concept of God is one of absolute majesty and supremacy. The uniqueness of Israel is that its whole history is a revelation of God’s total claim on the people and on each of its members in virtue of a special status. If the mystery religions also have a concept of slavery to the gods, this is entered into only by the appropriate rituals. Philo adopts the OT view except that for him the use is figurative, the self-sufficiency of God is stressed, and exaltation through the service of God becomes an important factor; the opposite of this service is dependence on creation and a corresponding lack of any spiritual relationship.

 

C. The Word Group in the NT.

 

1. Secular Usage.

 

a. Apart from some instances in the parables, in which the use is hardly a strict one, the word occurs in the ordinary sense only when the position of slaves is at issue, e.g., in Col. 3:22ff.; Eph. 6:8-9. The usage here falls wholly within the contemporary social framework. In the parables this is also true, but the total commitment of douéloi and the total claim of the kyérios serve here to illustrate the unconditional lordship of God and the unconditional responsibility of believers to him. Thus if slaves have two masters, as might happen, they cannot show the same commitment to both. Similarly, one cannot be a true douélos of God without throwing off mammon (Mt. 6:24).

 

b. While the NT offers the typical picture of the douélos, it does not hint at scorn or disparagement. It differs in this regard not only from the Greek world but also from Judaism, which tends to accept the lower social, cultic, and ethical status of slaves, to put slaves wholly under the control of their masters, and to regard the term “slave” as a deadly insult.

 

c. Slaves, then, are fully integrated into the community. If they have the chance of freedom, they are to take it (1 Cor. 7:21). But in any case they come with all believers under the common law of love which in the long run, if applied, necessarily means the end of slavery among Christians. If there is no campaign to abolish slavery, this is not due to otherworldiness, of a situation of eschatological tension, but rather to the fact that redemption, like sin, takes place within existing social structures, so that the first priority is not to change the structures but to achieve a life which is conformable to that of Jesus. Such a life will in due time break down the structures, because the fellowship of a common participation in Christ relativizes social distinctions. Thus Paul points out that Philemon and Onesimus are now brothers (v. 16). He also stresses that the relation to God takes precedence over the mutual relations of slaves and masters (Eph. 6:5ff.; Col. 3:22ff.; 1 Tim. 6:1; Tit. 2:9). Christians lie under this obligation even when their masters (or slaves) are not believers. The overriding freedom of faith that this expresses bears a superficial resemblance to the Stoic’s independence of external circumstances, but differs from it in three ways: a. there is no sense of superiority; b. it rests on an act which makes slave and master brothers; and c. this act is the crucifixion and resurrection of Christ for both.

 

2. Christians as douéloi of God and Christ.

 

a. The formula douélos theoué is rare in the NT; Christians are mostly called the douéloi of Christ. Where used, as in Lk. 1:38 (douéleœ); Acts 2:18; Revelation (cf. 10:7; 15:3), it usually has an OT basis. This applies in Acts 16:17 and probably also in

 

1 Pet. 2:16, since Christians are thought of here as the Israel of God. Jms. 1:1 and Tit. 1:1 are perhaps adopting a prophetic designation rather than describing absolute commitment to God, since in the usage of Judaism the phrase normally covers only outstanding figures (apart from the whole people), douélos theoué becomes more popular in the early church with the development of the idea that the church is the true Israel and a desire to distinguish between Christ as Son and believers as servants, but ideas of merit tend to arise as the phrase comes to denote specially dedicated people.

 

b. More common is the belief that Christians are the douéloi of Christ; Paul in particular represents this conviction. They are already douéloi of a sort prior to conversion, i.e., douéloi to sin etc. (Rom. 6:6ff., 19; Gal. 4:3, 8, 9), and even to the law (Rom. 7:1ff.). The meaning is that they have totally lost their freedom and are dominated by these forces. Jesus by his saving work rescues them from this douleiía in a work of liberation (Gal. 3:13; 4:4-5). They thus achieve the freedom of sonship (Gal. 4:5ff.; Rom. 8:15, 23). But sonship does not mean autonomy; it means a new relationship with God. The result is a new service. With his work of redemption Christ has made believers his own possession and now gives them the goals that shape their lives. This new commitment, which is a commitment to righteousness (Rom. 6:19), holiness (1 Th. 3:13), and newness of life (Rom. 6:4), finds expression in the description of Christians as Christ’s douéloi (1 Cor. 7:22; Eph. 6:6). This entails confession of what Christ has done and acceptance of its practical consequences. It is also a recognition of the freedom which can come only with commitment to Christ, so that there is no contradiction when John speaks of the freedom which the Son brings (Jn. 8:34ff.), or when he has Jesus say that he calls his disciples, not douéloi, but friends, for these are friends who do what he commands them (Jn. 15:14-15).

 

c. The phrase douélos Christoué has a special position when used as a designation, e.g., in the salutations of Paul, James, Jude, and Peter, and also in relation to Epaphras in Col. 4:12. The basis, of course, is the common commitment to Christ, so that the writers, being integrated into the community in subordination to the claim of Christ, cannot seek to dominate it. Yet in this context the term also suggests a specific office (cf. Jms. 1:1; Gal. 1:10) which carries with it the authority of the master himself. In Paul’s case (and cf. 2 Pet. 1:1), douélos Ieœsoué Christoué runs parallel to apoéstolos Ieœsoué Christoué;  the latter describes the outward relation, the former the inner relation which underlies it.

 

3. Jesus Christ as douélos.

 

a. When Jesus washes his disciples’ feet, he shows that it is his office, too, to serve, not to seek power or glory, for washing the feet is a servile duty (Jn. 13:1ff.). He also shows, of course, what will be the point of the disciples’ own lives as his apostles, for a douélos is not greater than his kyérios, nor an apoéstolos than the one who sends him (Jn. 13:16). Paul gives this lesson a more general application when he tells the Galatians that, just because they are called to freedom, they are to serve (douleuéein) one another in love (Gal. 5:13).

 

b. In Phil. 2:7 Jesus is said to take the form of a douélos. The phrase stands in contrast to the form of God in v. 6 and the title kyérios in v. 11. It thus shows what the incarnation means for Christ in relation to his inherent glory. It represents the low point on his way of keénoœsis (cf. Jn. 13:1ff.). There is no necessary allusion to Is. 53 (where paiís theoué would be the accepted rendering of the Hebrew). Nor do the terms humility (v. 3) and obedience (v. 8) fully encompass what is involved, for being a douélos involves a new situation (not just an attitude) which is inconceivably different from the prior situation and which carries with it subjection to the death of the cross

 

(v. 8). Paul’s exhortation in vv. 1-5 is thus given a kerygmatic basis in vv. 6ff. This servant form is, of course, the scandal of the gospel, but in God’s wisdom it is also its glory (vv. 9-11).

 

douloéoœ, katadouloéoœ. These terms are common from Herodotus and occur in the LXX in the sense “to enslave” both literally and figuratively. Except in Acts 7:6 (quoting Gen. 15:13), the NT use is always figurative. Not “bound” in marriage is the point in 1 Cor. 7:15. A definition of slavery is offered in 2 Pet. 2:19: What overcomes us, enslaves us. Though free, Paul has voluntarily forgone his rights for his work’s sake in 1 Cor. 9:9. Commitment to God (or his opponents) is at issue in Rom. 6:18 and Gal. 4:3. Judaizers are trying to enslave believers to their legalistic code in 2 Cor. 11:20. In contrast to being enslaved, Christians are freed by Christ to be responsible douéloi of God.

 

doulagoœgeéoœ. This rare word means “to cause to live the life of a slave.” Paul uses it in 1 Cor. 9:27 to show that he subordinates his soœÉma to his office and will not allow it to be a hindrance to him in discharging this office.

 

ophthalmodouliía. Not found outside the NT, this term refers in Eph. 6:6 to a douleiía of slaves which is outwardly satisfactory but does not express an inner obligation for the sake of God and Christ, so that the eyes of the master are deceived. It also occurs in the plural in Col. 3:22 for the actions that make up this deceitful service. [K. H. RENGSTORF, II, 261- 80]

 

docheœÉ ˘ deéchomai

 

Bromiley, Geoffrey W., ed. Theological Dictionary of the New Testament: Abridged in One Volume. Accordance electronic edition, version 1.8. Grand Rapids: Eerdmans, 1985.

 

similar  levels can be made with TWOT and Mounce OT. But it should be mentioned that Mounce i believe covers every word verses the most important ones.

 

-Dan 



#5 JonathanHuber

JonathanHuber

    Platinum

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 718 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Englewood, CO
  • Interests:Bible study, Greek
  • Accordance Version:10.x

Posted 13 October 2013 - 03:58 PM

If you are looking for help with word studies, you should look at the NIDOTTE/NIDNTT.



#6 davidmedina

davidmedina

    Gold

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 387 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:San Juan, Puerto Rico
  • Interests:God, my family, the Bible, photography and film.
  • Accordance Version:10.x

Posted 13 October 2013 - 04:08 PM

Dan, the Mounce's dictionary that comes with Accordance is not the same as the Mounce Expository Dictionary. Right?

 

Because that is my problem, the one that comes with Accordance is to basic.


"Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect." Rom. 12:2
 
Blog: The Renewed Mind.

#7 Dan Francis

Dan Francis

    Platinum

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 557 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Alberta, Canada
  • Accordance Version:10.x

Posted 13 October 2013 - 10:50 PM

[G1528] douvloß doulos 126x a male slave, or servant, of various degrees, Mt. 8:9, et al. freq.; a servitor, person of mean condition, Phil. 2:7; fem. dou/lh, a female slave; a handmaiden, Lk. 1:38, 48; Acts 2:18; douvloß, used figuratively, in a bad sense, one involved in moral or spiritual thraldom, Jn. 8:34; Rom. 6:17, 20; 1 Cor. 7:23; 2 Pet. 2:19; in a good sense, a devoted servant or minister, Acts 16:17; Rom. 1:1; one pledged or bound to serve, 1 Cor. 7:22; 2 Cor. 4:5 [G1400, G1401] See servant; slave.

 

 

Mounce, William D., D. Matthew Smith, and Miles V. Van Pelt, eds. Mounce’s Complete Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words. Accordance electronic edition, version 1.0. Grand Rapids: Zondervan, 2006.

 

As you see despite peoples praise of it by Accordance staff, it is really too basic…. for any real help, in my opinion. TDNT abridged and TWOT are good starter lexicons, very inexpensive and will likely do you. I have the Hendrickson ones and the mulit volume New International Dictionaries but 7/10 or more I find TDNT and TWOT providing me everything I want.

 

-Dan



#8 davidmedina

davidmedina

    Gold

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 387 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:San Juan, Puerto Rico
  • Interests:God, my family, the Bible, photography and film.
  • Accordance Version:10.x

Posted 13 October 2013 - 10:52 PM

Thanks. I will look at those. I like the good and inexpensive part, especially. :)


"Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect." Rom. 12:2
 
Blog: The Renewed Mind.

#9 bkMitchell

bkMitchell

    Silver

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 156 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Japan
  • Accordance Version:10.x

Posted 14 October 2013 - 05:02 AM

I am thinking of adding some dictionaries and lexicons to my Bible study collections and need some suggestion of what would be basic must have.

 

I'd recommend the Complete BDB 

http://www.accordanc...id=BDB Complete

Be, sure to the read the review of it. 

 

If, you already have the Abridged BDB http://www.accordanc...etails/?pid=BDB  you can update to the complete version for 50 USD see: http://www.accordanc...BDB Complete-up

 

At, the University of Texas in Austin work is underway on an updated version of the BDB. http://www.utexas.ed...s/mes/news/6768 this will be cool, but non the less I think you can get a lot of use out of Accordance's Complete BDB.


Edited by bkMitchell, 14 October 2013 - 05:03 AM.

חַפְּשׂוּ בַּתּוֹרָה הֵיטֵב וְאַל תִּסְתַּמְּכוּ עַל דְּבָרַי

#10 JonathanHuber

JonathanHuber

    Platinum

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPipPip
  • 718 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Englewood, CO
  • Interests:Bible study, Greek
  • Accordance Version:10.x

Posted 14 October 2013 - 07:18 AM

One last thought- you've mentioned in other threads your interest in learning the original languages and maybe upgrading to the essential collection. The Essential collection, which would also include the accordance graphics package, includes several standard lexicons and theological lexicons (BDB, Louw-Nida, TLOT, TLNT) that would help with the type of studies you're inquiring about here. If you are still considering that upgrade, I would suggest putting the money there before investing in additional standalone modules since the collection would add other additional works as well and provide the most value for the money. Just my 2 cents.


Edited by JonathanHuber, 14 October 2013 - 07:20 AM.


#11 jfidel

jfidel

    Silver

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 179 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Accordance Version:10.x

Posted 14 October 2013 - 09:48 AM

Hi David,

I would recommend you consider purchasing some good lexicons that you do not already have in your Logos library. NIDNTT and NIDOTTE are two that you probably do not already have and they are both excellent resources. The advise given above offers some other excellent resources, but you may have them already. These two are theological lexicons and  as such complement BDAG, HALOT and BDB well. Read the product reviews in the accordance website for more details on the above.



#12 davidmedina

davidmedina

    Gold

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 387 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:San Juan, Puerto Rico
  • Interests:God, my family, the Bible, photography and film.
  • Accordance Version:10.x

Posted 14 October 2013 - 11:15 AM

Thanks.

 

Yes, I do have some of them on my Logos 5. I want to get Accordance to some basic functionality but I agree that is better no to duplicate what I already have. 

 

I this point I do not see replacing Logos but taking advantage of what Accordance offers and supplementing what I already have with Accordance as a tool for quick Bible Studies. 

 

Thanks to everyone. 


"Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect." Rom. 12:2
 
Blog: The Renewed Mind.

#13 Timothy Jenney

Timothy Jenney

    Platinum

  • Accordance
  • 1,398 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:sunny Winter Haven, FL
  • Interests:a good cup of coffee, sci-fi, playing bass, listing to jazz and the blues, camping, fishing and the great outdoors
  • Accordance Version:10.x

Posted 14 October 2013 - 11:52 AM

One of the problems "Accordance staff" have in making recommendations is that we have a very wide range of users: novices to Bible study with little or no formal training (but a high level of interest) to some of the world's top experts in biblical studies. Obviously, what is too basic for some will be "just right" for others, while what others find informative can "overwhelm" those with less expertise. Not surprisingly, the request for recommendations often comes from those with less expertise. [The experts already know what resources are available in the field, in fact, they have often contributed to them! :-) ]

 

I find Mounce’s Complete Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Words a good "first step" up from the basic Mounce and Mounce/Kholenberger dictionaries included with every copy of Accordance. At $30 , it offers the best "bang for the buck" for English-only users. Its size is also very attractive to Accordance for iOS users trying to conserve storage space. It's integration into the basic dictionaries also makes it very easy for those new to Accordance to amplify to them. [Dan, if you had clicked on "servant, slave" you would have found much better information.]

 

NIDNTT and NIDOTT are a BIG step up from Mounce's Expository Dictionary, but at a much higher price ($270). [NIDNTT-A (Abridged) is an excellent value at $30, but an equivalent for Hebrew is not available.] These volumes are still accessible to the English-only users, but are also good resources for those who have had some Hebrew and Greek. They are designed to address practical issues in interpretation, not just linguistic subtleties.

 

Those with language training usually prefer the standard lexicons in the field: BDAG, HALOT, DCH, etc., though most English-only find them frustrating to use. TDNT and TDOT are also widely used by scholars, but suffer from methodological problems. Those "in the know" mine them for data, but ignore their overall conclusions.

 

i hope this brief sketch of lexicons will be helpful, everyone!


Edited by Timothy Jenney, 14 October 2013 - 11:56 AM.

Blessings,
"Dr. J"

Timothy P. Jenney, Ph. D.
"Lighting the Lamp" Host and Producer

#14 davidmedina

davidmedina

    Gold

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 387 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:San Juan, Puerto Rico
  • Interests:God, my family, the Bible, photography and film.
  • Accordance Version:10.x

Posted 14 October 2013 - 12:38 PM

Very helpful as you read me well.

 

That is why I was attracted to Mounce's Complete Expository Dictionary. As a first step from what Accordance Bible Study coms with and a intermediate step with something deeper.  The way I was told was that Mounce's is like a Vine's, concise but a step above Strong's Dictionary. Is that a correct comparison? 

 

Would the NIDTT-A be a step above Mounce? 

 

I noticed that too that in Mounce, if I clicked on Servant I got more information and that links to what Accordance has allowing me to check that first for a quick definition and then click on Mounce for more explanation and if that is not enough then I can go to something more comprehensive.

 

Dr. J, what would you suggest, to get those individual books I need or to go to the Essential collection instead? I am no scholar nor a pastor, I am just a Bible student that want to start going deeper in my Bible study and understanding.

 

Thanks. 


Edited by davidmedina, 14 October 2013 - 12:42 PM.

"Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect." Rom. 12:2
 
Blog: The Renewed Mind.

#15 Timothy Jenney

Timothy Jenney

    Platinum

  • Accordance
  • 1,398 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:sunny Winter Haven, FL
  • Interests:a good cup of coffee, sci-fi, playing bass, listing to jazz and the blues, camping, fishing and the great outdoors
  • Accordance Version:10.x

Posted 14 October 2013 - 01:08 PM

Hi, David!

 

Glad I was able to help. I thought you would enjoy the Complete Expository Dictionary. The NIDNTT-A would indeed be a huge step up from it, but remember that it will only cover the NT.

 

Buy these instead of the Essential Collection? Ouch! You don't ask easy questions.  I don't remember what you currently own, but you might want to compare it to what the Essentials includes. Here's a link: http://www.accordanc...ions-Comparison. [Essential Collection = Bible Study Collection + Original Languages Collection+ Graphics Package.]

 

There are many different ways to gain insight into the meaning of Bible passages. Some people only use [or mostly use] one, like looking up the meanings of words. Other people aren't content until they research the history, culture and customs, the geographic setting and climate, the literary context, etc. I fall into this latter group. The Essential Collection is better for people like me because it offers a much more well-rounded set of resources. After all, it includes an Atlas, great photographs of Bible places, and a timeline. It also includes many of the standard lexicons preferred by scholars.

 

I think I'd recommend the Essential Collection, then add the other resources later, if the Essential Collection doesn't provide enough. It's a great base package—and it will give you some really nice tools to present the results of your studies to others, too.


  • davidmedina likes this
Blessings,
"Dr. J"

Timothy P. Jenney, Ph. D.
"Lighting the Lamp" Host and Producer

#16 davidmedina

davidmedina

    Gold

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 387 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:San Juan, Puerto Rico
  • Interests:God, my family, the Bible, photography and film.
  • Accordance Version:10.x

Posted 14 October 2013 - 01:26 PM

Like you, I am too in the later group. But I also like to consult, at the end of my study, Commentaries to make sure and check myself that I am not off base in my conclusions. 

 

Currently I have the Bible Study Collection to which I have added the IVP Essential, NAS95, ESV Study Bible and the Mounce Complete Expository Dic. 

 

I also have Logos 5 with an extensive library (Platinum Collection). But as a caveat, if I can get the "right" combination of the resources I need to study with Accordance and for less, I can cancel my purchase with logos as I have 30 days. I don't need to have the most extensive library but the "right" one for my needs. 

 

Although I don't believe in the need of having as many resources as possible, I want to make sure I do have a solid Accordance Library with the right combination of basic and solid resources that would actually let me study the Bible using just Accordance. Right now, it feels like the Bible Collection does not have enough and I have the need to go to where I know I will have the resources which for me is obviously Logos at this time.  I know that I should not overlap, if possible, but I also want to have am Accordance that is complete in itself to be useful as study tool.

 

Does that make sense?

 

My only concur with the Essential Collection is that while it adds the language Collection it does not add anything in the way of any commentaries. Would what I have with the Essential as Commentaries enough? or there is anything I could add to supplement it?

 

Based on what you mentioned in the Podcast on Commentaries , I prefer evangelical, conservative and reformed resources.


Edited by davidmedina, 14 October 2013 - 01:44 PM.

"Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect." Rom. 12:2
 
Blog: The Renewed Mind.

#17 Timothy Jenney

Timothy Jenney

    Platinum

  • Accordance
  • 1,398 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:sunny Winter Haven, FL
  • Interests:a good cup of coffee, sci-fi, playing bass, listing to jazz and the blues, camping, fishing and the great outdoors
  • Accordance Version:10.x

Posted 14 October 2013 - 07:56 PM

Hi, David!

 

Yes, that helps. Under the circumstances, I think the move to Essentials would be great. You already have the Expository dictionary and you will acquire a number of original language lexicons.

 

You also have the IVP set, which I absolutely love. I am especially fond of the two. In fact, since you have the IVP set, you might want to call the people at sales and see what it would cost to upgrade to Advanced. It includes a large number of commentaries and adds the IVP set (which you already have , so they may deduct that from your upgrade. Hmmm...) That would make especially good sense if you do decide to go "all in with" Accordance and return the other software.

 

Isn't it fun to have so many choices? And they are all good! Whatever you decide to do, you will have a wealth of resources to study the Bible.

 

God bless.


Blessings,
"Dr. J"

Timothy P. Jenney, Ph. D.
"Lighting the Lamp" Host and Producer

#18 davidmedina

davidmedina

    Gold

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 387 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:San Juan, Puerto Rico
  • Interests:God, my family, the Bible, photography and film.
  • Accordance Version:10.x

Posted 14 October 2013 - 08:32 PM

Choices... Boy it sure makes life interesting.  :) And like you said, they are all good. That is what makes it hard to choose. The great thing is that there isn't much overlap between both. 

 

Thanks so much for your advice. I will be calling them tomorrow to see what options I have and go from there. 


"Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect." Rom. 12:2
 
Blog: The Renewed Mind.

#19 Unix

Unix

    Silver

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 100 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Accordance Version:10.x

Posted 15 October 2013 - 03:50 AM

Others may suggest Anchor Yale Bible Dictionary, but New Interpreters Dictionary of the Bible is in fact much better, see:
http://www.accordanc....com/store/sale $239.99 until October 21. 2013.
... it's also available much cheaper in Logos and more orders on it are needed there so that it makes it into production faster.

I have it as printed matter (plus the Logos pre-pub order since long before that).






0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users