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#1 Joel Brown

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Posted 01 August 2005 - 02:13 PM

I know theres been lots of (well, seems like lots of to me) requests for this Accordance widget and talk about what it might or might not do. Well, it just got released today, so I urge everyone to go check it out! I was doing a lot of the work on it, so I'm curious as to your comments, be it about look, functionality, anything. This is the initial release, so I'm open to listen to other ideas (if they are feasible, of course).
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#2 rinodattilo

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Posted 01 August 2005 - 02:35 PM

Joel,

First, I think this is just awesome! Thanks for the great work on it, really!

So, because you asked - there are a few things that I would love to see:

1. The ability to remove poetry
2. Ability to bold scripture ref - in notes and hand outs it makes it stand out
3. Is it possible to have “copy as citation“ ref at the biggining of the passage (in bold of course)

For me, that would just make it complete, but I am sure that I will see other suggestions and then I might just like those.

Again, Great Job!

Rino

#3 David Leighton

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Posted 01 August 2005 - 05:15 PM

Hi

Am I just been thick. I have down loaded 6.7 and it installed fine. But I could not find the widget!
David Leighton

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#4 Joel Brown

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Posted 01 August 2005 - 05:30 PM

It *should* be on your desktop.
IF you have 10.4 (Helen)

Edited by Helen Brown, 01 August 2005 - 05:35 PM.

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#5 Helen Brown

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Posted 01 August 2005 - 08:28 PM

Does anybody LIKE the widget? Apart from Rino, that is.
Helen Brown
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#6 R. Mansfield

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Posted 01 August 2005 - 10:15 PM

I really like the widget. I think it could become quite helpful.

One suggestion and one lament...

- Could it be designed so that the particular Bible version/translation could be changed from the front instead of having to spin it to the back? Just a couple of extra clicks, granted, but it would be handy.

- I am disappointed that Greek and Hebrew don't work with MS Word at all. I understand that it's a Word issue due to lack of unicode support. But I still do most of my work in Word. Only being able to use the widget for English texts with Word will severely limits its use for me. I registered a copy of Mellel a few weeks ago, but it's just not quite there for me yet.
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#7 R. Mansfield

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Posted 01 August 2005 - 10:44 PM

By the way, the new widget looks really SHARP, too. The scroll effect is perfect.
___
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#8 Joe Weaks

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Posted 08 August 2005 - 12:16 AM

It *should* be on your desktop.
IF you have 10.4 (Helen)


I have exactly no impression of the Widget because I haven't seen it yet. I, like the majority of Mac users aren't using 10.4. However, we can use many Widgets via third party solutions. Why not make the Widget available as standalone somewhere so that we can have a look at it?

And I really don't understand why pasting Greek text into Word is encountering problems. R2L Hebrew I understand, but not Greek. Something's not right here.

Please pardon the latent response to the release, as I've been in the process of moving.

#9 John Allard

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Posted 08 August 2005 - 02:21 AM

Does anybody LIKE the widget? Apart from Rino, that is.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Sorry to repeat my input from another topic, but I love the widget! While I greatly value the scholarly work that Accordance is doing, I don't know how to use all of it, but in the mean time the widget is a cool gadget that may get a response from the "younger" crowd. Thanks again, it's very useful.

#10 Helen Brown

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Posted 08 August 2005 - 09:36 AM

I have exactly no impression of the Widget because I haven't seen it yet. I, like the majority of Mac users aren't using 10.4. However, we can use many Widgets via third party solutions. Why not make the Widget available as standalone somewhere so that we can have a look at it?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

OK, I have posted a separate download for the widget, for those who want to try it with third party software. I had already sent it to two such users, neither of whom has reported back on whether it works at all, which we doubt. You can download it here.

And I really don't understand why pasting Greek text into Word is encountering problems. R2L Hebrew I understand, but not Greek. Something's not right here.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

We encountered a problem in Word 2004 in that we are pasting unstyled Unicode text and Word apparently requires styled text. We were unable to get around it, and since the Hebrew in any case is not supported, we are using plain text for the English, and not supporting the Unicode paste at all in Word. We can update this in the future if we find a workaround.
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#11 Ed Cross

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Posted 11 August 2005 - 03:54 PM

I actually like the widget, looks nice. The Auto Insert and Auto Search features work quite well.

Now, if we could only change the default format of "Copy to Citation" within Accordance so that the widget pulls the format we want this would be golden.

Awaiting Version 7!

Pastor Ed Cross

PS. It can be used in Amnesty, but not the Auto Insert or Auto Search features.

#12 caorongjin

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Posted 11 August 2005 - 05:43 PM

Does anybody LIKE the widget? Apart from Rino, that is.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I like the interface and usability of the widget. As somebody had posted earlier, it has a very clean look and nice art. :D

My only complaint is that it requires Accordance to be open in order to use the biblical texts. :blink: Each widget already is a memory hog and having to launch Accordance to support it is overhead I would prefer not to have.

For example, the widget R2ToDo always launches iCal to aquire its data where as the widget iCal Events can parse and handle the data independent of the application. It requires less memory, gets the information it needs faster, and doesn't leave all these programs open.

#13 Joel Brown

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Posted 11 August 2005 - 09:22 PM

You have a very valid complaint, one I greatly wanted to avoid. However, the way the texts are stored within the Modules is *extremely* complicated. Not only would it have to interact with the preferences to find out which modules are unlocked, but figure out how to read and turn the raw binary into a usable feature. Then convert to unicode. Then make a similar reference reading algorithm to what Accordance uses. Then add in the citation code. Though it would have been a great possibility, it was too much work, and a significant security risk. As far as I know, there is no way to hide the code that makes a widget work (save making it not even readable in permissions, but I'm not sure how that would affect the functionality), so anyone would be able to look inside and essentially 'crack' the module code. I'm not an expert in this, but this seems like a huge security risk.
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#14 Joe Weaks

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Posted 11 August 2005 - 09:40 PM

My only complaint is that it requires Accordance to be open in order to use the biblical texts

You have a very valid complaint, one I greatly wanted to avoid. However, the way the texts are stored within the Modules is *extremely* complicated... and a significant security risk.

I'd listen to Joel here; he knows of what he speaks. The iCal data can be parsed by a simple Widget easily because the data is in a public open access XML text format. Just open a calendar in TextEdit and you'll see what I mean.
However, we need to appreciate how much complexity is involved in the Accordance module format (the very complexity that allows for the stunning searches and flexibility we know and love).
The graphic on the Widget is really good, and I think Joel and his colleagues made a sound decision in keeping the Widget simple. And besides, why on God's green earth do you ever have Accordance closed!?!

#15 caorongjin

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Posted 12 August 2005 - 01:13 AM

I'd listen to Joel here; he knows of what he speaks. The iCal data can be parsed by a simple Widget easily because the data is in a public open access XML text format. Just open a calendar in TextEdit and you'll see what I mean.

Yeah, I figured it was more complicated than the iCal data. I've looked into the iCalendar format that Apple uses in the past but I wasn't quite sure how complicated the Accordance module format is... which, I guess the answer is: very. :D

And besides, why on God's green earth do you ever have Accordance closed!?!

Um... sorry pastor.... um... i don't know. :unsure:

#16 dgzylstra

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Posted 05 September 2005 - 10:17 AM

Hello All.

I like the widget, but it kind of annoys me that every time I go into Expose the widget opens up Accordance. Is it possible to make the widget access the Accordance modules without having to open up the entire program? Or could it at least be made so that it only opens up the program when you actually use the widget?

---------------------------------

Ooops, sorry! I see that this question has already been addressed to some degree. I understand that there are problems with trying to do what I want, but it would still be nice... ;-)

Edited by dgzylstra, 05 September 2005 - 10:19 AM.


#17 DavidKrishef

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 03:18 PM

Forgive me if this question has been addressed -- since the widget opens Accordance, I don't see the point in using the widget to find verses -- why not skip the widget step and just plug the verse reference into Accordance directly?

If you have used the Widget and found it to save time, please let me know how you used it!

DK
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#18 Joel Brown

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Posted 26 September 2005 - 05:27 PM

I don't mean to speak for others, but this is why the widget was made. It is much easier to, no matter where you are, hit F12 or whatever you want for the dashboard, type in your reference, and have it right there. If you have to command tab or find the Accordance icon in the dock, thats more time, and you then have to find what you were working on. Add to that automatic verse insert, which requires an extra copy and paste in Accordance, and automatic verse lookup, if you have a verse reference selected, again normally requires extra copying and pasting. This doesn't necessarily do anything radically new, just provides a convenience and speeds things up.

Edited by Helen Brown, 04 December 2005 - 03:28 PM.

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#19 Alistair

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Posted 18 October 2005 - 11:30 AM

The widget is a "Good Thing™" but I won't use it.

The widget still has to fire up Accordance but doesn't give the flexibility or control that Accordance itself gives.

On an older and slower system it requires too many steps when you can go directly to Accordance and get it get it faster. On a 4GHz G6 dual processer Mac with 4 GB of RAM I might try it, but not with my rusty old powerbook.

It's a step forward, but it's just another dashboard gimmick as far as I am concerned. I still miss the Online Bible FKey (Yay for System 7!), which despite a couple of brave attempts to imitate and emulate remains the best every quick entry method for Bible texts.

~Alistair

#20 David Lang

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Posted 19 October 2005 - 07:38 AM

Alistair,

I'm a little surprised by your statement that the widget requires "too many steps." Have you checked the "Auto Insert" option? Doing so essentially duplicates the functionality of the old OLB F-Key. You can also use control-plus and minus to change the Bible text used without flipping the widget over.

For more on how the widget compares with other verse-insertion utilities, see my article on the web-site of the Christian Macintosh Users Group: OS X Verse Insertion Utilities Compared.

Hope this helps.
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