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Details window distinguishing verbs by caps?!


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#1 Rod Decker

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Posted 20 December 2008 - 12:02 PM

I just noticed that the details window in GNT and GNT-T differentiate between some forms based only on an initial cap. This seems to be a very odd decision since the cap changes nothing in terms of the form. Am I missing something here?

E.g., here's the search I just ran and the Details window data (sorry, but the "Quote" formatting strips out all the indentation):

Total number of verses = 6
(total number of verses displayed = 6)

[verb perfect pass ind] @πειθω (6 total words)

πείθω to persuade; believe; trust = 6
Indicative = 6
Perfect = 6
Passive = 6
First = 6
Singular = 5
Πέπεισμαι = 1
πέπεισμαι = 4
Plural (variant) = 1
Πεπείσμεθα = 1


In the 1SRPI this distinguishes 1 form Πέπεισμαι and 4 of πέπεισμαι. I really think this should be simply: "πέπεισμαι = 5."
Rodney J. Decker, ThD
Professor of NT & Greek
Baptist Bible Seminary
NTResources.com/blog/

#2 Joe Weaks

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Posted 20 December 2008 - 05:05 PM

Rod,
Please explain your sort selections in the column in the Set Analysis Display dialog. "Lex" or "Inflect" or "Tag" or which ones?
Joe Weaks
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#3 Rod Decker

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Posted 20 December 2008 - 05:42 PM

Rod,
Please explain your sort selections in the column in the Set Analysis Display dialog. "Lex" or "Inflect" or "Tag" or which ones?


Here's a clip of the setting dialog:

Attached File  SetAnalysisDisplay.jpg   37.64KB   16 downloads
Rodney J. Decker, ThD
Professor of NT & Greek
Baptist Bible Seminary
NTResources.com/blog/

#4 Helen Brown

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Posted 20 December 2008 - 10:43 PM

Accordance does distinguish capitalized words and inflected forms from all lower case, and has done so for many years in English and Greek.
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#5 Joe Weaks

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Posted 21 December 2008 - 01:23 AM

Rod,
Reason I asked is because my results are a little different:

πείθω to persuade; believe; trust = 6
....Indicative = 6
........Perfect = 6
............Passive = 6
................First = 6
....................Singular = 5
........................(No inflected form) = 5
....................Plural (variant) = 1
........................(No inflected form) = 1

You're searching [verb perfect pass ind] @πειθω in the GNT-T, right?

Oh, and yes, capitalized inflected forms are differentiated.

#6 Rod Decker

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Posted 21 December 2008 - 06:47 AM

Accordance does distinguish capitalized words and inflected forms from all lower case, and has done so for many years in English and Greek.


I guess I'm just slow then since I'd not noticed before. Is there some rationale for this practice (other than saving a step in the programming by not normalizing the forms)? If the purpose of a morphological search is to identify morphological forms, then it would seem counterproductive to distinguish forms that are morphologically identical. Caps never distinguish one form from another in Greek (unlike, say, German in which all nouns are capitalized). Unless there is some compelling reason for the present practice, then I recommend that this be reconsidered in handling tagged Greek texts.
Rodney J. Decker, ThD
Professor of NT & Greek
Baptist Bible Seminary
NTResources.com/blog/

#7 Joe Weaks

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Posted 23 December 2008 - 11:14 PM

Rodney,

The differentiation in caps in your example is only happening at the "Inflect" level... the actual physical occurrence of the glyphs in the analysis breakdown. They aren't differentiated in any of the meaningful levels. You search for passives and they're both included in the count. You search for "πέπεισμαι" as an inflected form and you get both forms still.

Joe




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