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Can I vent about Logos?


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#1 ryangeer

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 12:52 PM

I recently decided to go native on my Mac and expunge bootcamp/vmware fusion/[unnamed bible software]... Finally free.

I sold my copy of [unnamed bible software] after an email exchange with a cust. svc. supervisor who told me that it was no problem - call her or any member of her team. I called today - and after a 30 minute wait on hold got a guy who told me "there is a freeze on transfers of base products..." until he saw the email and then put me on hold for another 5-10 minutes only to tell me to leave a message on voice mail for a supervisor (apparently they are all out on vacation and there are only 2 people in the co. that can help me). Did I mention how discourteous and unhelpful this guy was? Compare that to Accordance - I had a couple modules I needed desperately and Helen (while on vacation) had it nailed down within minutes.

Edited by ryangeer, 02 January 2010 - 01:34 PM.


#2 Joel Brown

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 01:12 PM

Thanks for the comments, Ryan. We appreciate your retelling of your experiences with our customer service. However, we prefer that our forums not be used as a venue for the criticism of other software companies.
Joel Brown

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#3 RogueMonk

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 02:50 PM

I recently decided to go native on my Mac and expunge bootcamp/vmware fusion/logos... Finally free.

I sold my copy of Logos after an email exchange with a cust. svc. supervisor who told me that it was no problem - call her or any member of her team. I called today - and after a 30 minute wait on hold got a guy who told me "there is a freeze on transfers of base products..." until he saw the email and then put me on hold for another 5-10 minutes only to tell me to leave a message on voice mail for a supervisor (apparently they are all out on vacation and there are only 2 people in the co. that can help me). Did I mention how discourteous and unhelpful this guy was? Compare that to Accordance - I had a couple modules I needed desperately and Helen (while on vacation) had it nailed down within minutes.


I find this post in bad taste, bordering on slander. I have emailed it to Logos so they are aware of it, complete with screen shots. There is no reason to bash another company. It reflects badly on the OP and on Accordance.
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#4 David Lang

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 04:41 PM

RogueMonk,

Joel responded within twenty minutes of Ryan's post asking that the forums not be used as a venue for criticizing other software companies. We believe that's all the action we need to take.

We are generally loath to censor posts to this forum unless they clearly violate the Forum Guidelines. Those guidelines state, among other things, that "Content directly attacking the character of a person or group is also prohibited." As far as I can see, Ryan's post did not attack anyone's character; he simply described a negative customer service experience and contrasted it with a positive one. I'm afraid I just don't see how this "borders on slander."

By the way, just as we're unwilling to censor Ryan's post, we would certainly allow you or other folks to post your own contrasting experiences. We have no problem with anyone saying, "Hey, every experience I've had with Logos has been positive." There have been plenty of cases where our users have compared Accordance unfavorably to this or that product, and we haven't tried to squelch those opinions either.
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#5 William B

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 04:48 PM

I find this post in bad taste, bordering on slander. I have emailed it to Logos so they are aware of it, complete with screen shots. There is no reason to bash another company. It reflects badly on the OP and on Accordance.

That comes accross as quite a significant over reaction. Its very clear in the original post that the user is simply stressed and venting - a very human thing to do, and as is biblical he was gently told this is not how things should be done on these forums. Lets disregard the two companys here and remember that the person venting is your brother in Christ?, as as such you are called and commanded to love them as such. I think its important to rememember that regardless of companys, preferences and opinions Christ is above all and we have to keep things in context.

Edited by William B, 29 December 2009 - 04:50 PM.


#6 Timothy Jenney

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 06:07 PM

Ryan,

I am sorry that you had such a poor experience with Logos, but hope you will share it with them so they have the opportunity to make it right. These kinds of things do happen, particularly during the holidays when many companies are short of staff. All too often customers "vote with their feet" by simply leaving without ever saying a word. Without feedback like yours, companies never have the opportunity to improve their service.

I know we here at Accordance would want to hear from one of our customers that had a bad experience—and we'd prefer to hear it first, so we could at least have a chance to correct our mistake before it was shared with others. This is entirely in keeping with Matthew 18.

However, let me assure you that nothing in your post was libelous [which is the correct term, not "slanderous"], provided you gave an accurate account. Let me recommend an article, written in plain English, to all readers of this thread about how to discern whether a statement constitutes libel or slander: http://www.ehow.com/...-correctly.html

Edited by Timothy Jenney, 29 December 2009 - 06:09 PM.

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#7 RogueMonk

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 10:16 PM

Its very clear in the original post that the user is simply stressed and venting - a very human thing to do.


It seems to me that venting on a public forum is the wrong context for such human activity. I don't see how Christ is honoured in the original post. Neither are the brotther/sister in Christ as logos portrayed with much respect.

#8 jackcav

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Posted 29 December 2009 - 10:37 PM

We have no problem with anyone saying, "Hey, every experience I've had with Logos has been positive."


Since you said it was OK to write a post defending Logos CS. What Ryan fails to take into account is that Logos CS has been experiencing an exceptionally high volume of traffic and working extra hours due to the release of L4. If Logos gave them a well-deserved Christmas vacation, callers should understand. License transfer is not a life or death situation.

BTW, I also defend Accordance on the Logos forums when someone makes an unjustified attack.

Edited by jackcav, 31 December 2009 - 10:34 PM.


#9 Chuck Schneider

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Posted 30 December 2009 - 09:11 AM

I find this post in bad taste, bordering on slander. I have emailed it to Logos so they are aware of it, complete with screen shots. There is no reason to bash another company. It reflects badly on the OP and on Accordance.


The forcefulness of your response really kind of knocked me back. :)

I think you are being too rough on Ryan and your assessment that his post reflects badly on Accordance is really unfair.

My heart goes out to Accordance folks who must be squirming in their seats about all this. :) They've got one person complimenting them in an awkward manner and another person apparently trying to use that compliment as proof that Accordance has somehow done something awful.
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#10 Outis

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Posted 30 December 2009 - 11:59 AM

If your question is "can I vent about Logos", then I'm concluding from the posts here, the answer is "no."

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#11 Greg Terry

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Posted 31 December 2009 - 10:20 PM

There is no equal to the support Accordance gives it' users. I don't think Helen ever sleeps! I have received responses from her after I posted a question at 1am!

Other companies should put the service back in customer service like the fine folks at Accordance do!

Thanks to Helen, Joel and the rest of the gang at Accordance.

Happy New Year to all!
Peace!

Greg


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#12 Bob Deacon

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Posted 01 January 2010 - 06:46 AM

There is no equal to the support Accordance gives it' users. I don't think Helen ever sleeps! I have received responses from her after I posted a question at 1am


As a recent "switcher" I would have to agree! Sales, Customer Service and Tech Support get 5 stars from me!

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#13 ryangeer

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Posted 02 January 2010 - 01:28 PM

I had no idea this would provoke the vigorous attack of a rogue monk... It was an extremely frustrating phone call in which the operator was rather belligerent, however the post although factually true wasn't necessary. If I could do things over again, I'd probably just post more flowery praise about how great Accordance is.

I would be interested, Mr. Monk, in whatever response your vigorous defense of Logos generated from that company...

#14 ryangeer

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Posted 02 January 2010 - 01:36 PM

I've edited my original post to remove the name of the company involved...

#15 Timothy Jenney

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Posted 03 January 2010 - 10:55 AM

Bless you, Ryan.

Trust this year will bring great things for you!

Blessings,
"Dr. J"

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#16 RogueMonk

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Posted 08 January 2010 - 01:12 AM

I had no idea this would provoke the vigorous attack of a rogue monk... It was an extremely frustrating phone call in which the operator was rather belligerent, however the post although factually true wasn't necessary. If I could do things over again, I'd probably just post more flowery praise about how great Accordance is.

I would be interested, Mr. Monk, in whatever response your vigorous defense of Logos generated from that company...

I have never used Logos. I am a happy Accordance user.

I'm not really sure how to respond further. Words like "vigorous attack" and "vigorous defence" seem like overstatement and hyperbole to me. It makes one wonder of the initial post was exaggeration too. Alas, I suppose this all part an parcel of online communication.

As for a response from Logos, it was prompt and charitable. It also and conveyed a measure of regret that its name had been highlighted in this way, and a hope that that would not have any negative effect on its ministry.

#17 Fr. Rich

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Posted 08 January 2010 - 10:52 AM

I have never used Logos. I am a happy Accordance user.

I'm not really sure how to respond further. Words like "vigorous attack" and "vigorous defence" seem like overstatement and hyperbole to me. It makes one wonder of the initial post was exaggeration too. Alas, I suppose this all part an parcel of online communication.

As for a response from Logos, it was prompt and charitable. It also and conveyed a measure of regret that its name had been highlighted in this way, and a hope that that would not have any negative effect on its ministry.


As a former lawyer I can assure you that accusing someone of slander (more properly libel) is a fairly vigorous attack. Other than that, it appears to me that this horse is dead. Can we stop beating it and move on, please?

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#18 Helen Brown

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Posted 08 January 2010 - 11:10 AM

I entirely agree that this is a dead horse, and I am closing the topic, all the more so since Ryan posted a follow up note just yesterday.
Helen Brown
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