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Problems with 1.4


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#1 Guntis

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 11:35 AM

Accordance 1.4 for iOS notes:

Wider margins. Why so wide?! 1 cm wide margins on iPad seems too much. 0.5 cm would be more than enough. iPhone has rather small screen — who came up with the idea to reduce text area by increasing margins??? Grrrrr. Maybe you could increase margins to one inch and there would be no need for new features as there would be no text visible anymore.

Why I can’t define verse number colour and size? They are displayed so prominently that they ruin all text flow in paragraph view mode. I see only big fat verse numbers.

User note indicators (red dots). Can’t tap on them. This is touch-screen device! Then place real notes icons next to the verse number, so I can tap them. Absolutely nonintuitive approach.

When I tap-and-hold verse number, choose user-note, Accordance opens note editing window. All I want is just to see my note. Why Accordance can’t open notes in the pop-up window, and if I really want to edit them, there could be Edit button. Note icon next to the verse number would make this one tap shorter — tap and note icon opens it in popup window. Press edit button in the popup window if you want to edit it. Or tap-and-hold note icon to enter edit mode directly.

Open NRSVS to Mat 1:1. Tap-and-hold on “Messiah”, tap on «Amplify» > tap on «Word». Dictionary opens with this word in red colour. OK, I read it, how to get back to the text? Back button is not active. I tap-and-hold on magnifying glass, tap on Read … no, I’m back in dictionary. Stuck here. Turns out I have to tap on the Library button at the bottom left corner, then on the NRSVS and then I’m back in the Bible text. Why so difficult? You should provide direct return path from the amplification screen.

Open NRSV to Luke 8. Open ESV Study Bible in the split window. In the split window tap on the first line link: “Introduction: Key Themes”. Scroll down few screens to the Outline there. Scroll outline few screens down, then scroll it up — every outline point is doubled. A bug. And suppose I want to read this outline full screen — how? There is no option to swap split screen and main screen content, there is no button to zoom resource full screen. I have to close split screen, open Library, open appropriate section, open that resource, navigate to the appropriate location. Too long and too complex to do it. All just because one button is missing.

Another problem here: In the ESV Study Bible just before outline for Luke begins is a small map thumbnail. Tap it. To get back I have to tap once on the map, then tap on the “ESV Study Bible” button in the top left corner. Why I can’t use just two-finger swipe or three-finger swipe or pinch to the right to return back? Not very user-friendly navigation. It’s irritating to search for the way back if you could just swipe with 2 or 3 fingers to return back. Please improve navigation here.

Highlighter problem: tap-and-hold verse number, choose Highlight Verse, choose colour: Yellow. Now tap-and-hold on any word in that verse, choose Highlight: Magenta. Oops! Verse is not highlighted anymore, only reference in yellow and one word in magenta. Why? I didn’t remove yellow highlighter, why is it removed? (The same strange behaviour also in Accordance for Mac). I understand that I stack one highlighter on top of the other, not remove them by adding another one. Please fix this. And how can I apply different colour to 5 words or underline portion of highlighted text? Tap and highlight word by word? Ohhh… Why there’s no selection handles which I could use to select several words for highlighting? Why such stiff approach?

On the iPad, in vertical orientation: open ESV, set searching for words, search for “pigs”. 16 hits in 16 verses found. At the bottom is Luke 8:32, exactly what I was looking for. I want to open it, but… how? I try to scroll it up, but I can’t. I tap-and-hold on the verse reference, but there is no button “Open to Here” or anything similar. So I have to write down on paper Luke 8:32, then tap on the Go To button and enter this reference. Now suddenly the same search result list freely jumps up so that Luke 8:32 is now at the top of the screen, and now I can scroll search results up and down. Why suddenly it’s scrollable now? And now if I tap-and-hold Search button and tap on the Read, I can read verse in context. Something’s very unnatural in this approach. When I tap-and-hold verse reference number, please add “Open to Here” or “Open this verse in Context” button. And Back button then would return me back to the search results list, and not skip search and go the the previous Go To reference. I need possibility to read any search result in its context and return back to the search result list to check some other hits in their context.

No gesture to go to the next/previous chapter. Why not use two- and three-finger gestures to navigate chapters or open Go To menu? By the way, Go To grid doesn’t fit on iPhone’s screen, although it easily could. Please make grid smaller so that all grid fits into one screen.

On the iPad Library screen could be organised into two panes, just like iPad’s system Settings: left side Recent Modules, Texts, English Tools, Greek Tools, etc., and in right side their respective content. No need to open each section and then tap on the top left corner to return back. All could be done in 1 screen just by tapping section titles. And please add «Alphabetise» or «Sort» button for module sorting! For larger libraries this is essential!

Why did you increased top toolbar height for iPhones? It’s already has quite small screen, and now you made it even smaller, even less space is left for the Bible text. I hoped there will be one-tap feature to hide toolbars, but no, that is not implemented.

After all these quirks, I’m switching back to BibleReader. At least for now. I’m really frustrated with Accordance for iOS 1.4… BibleReader 5 is not as powerful as Accordance, but at least I can navigate there, switch tools in the split window to the main window, open notes in pop-up windows, navigate from search results to the text in context and back to the search results, etc. Accordance is faster, but I often want to ask engineers who made it: do you actually use Accordance yourselves? If you’d use it, you’d never make such awkward navigation and so small screen for the text on the iPhone, and grid which doesn’t fit in one screen, and images which require to reveal toolbar just to get back to the text. Why in image view mode toolbars can be hidden, but in text mode can’t? All my joy of new features in Accordance is ruined with utterly bad navigation experience…
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“Teach the way of God in Accordance” (Matt 12:14, NIV-Accordance edition)
“Those who live in Accordance (with the Spirit) have their minds set on what the Spirit desires.” (Rom 8:5, NIV-Accordance edition)

#2 Kit

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 02:04 PM

A very good, constructive and thoughtful review. However, if your tone can be softened a bit, that would be much appreciated.
Anyway, I believe that the team has done a great job already. Of course your comments are good for improvement.

Edited by Kit, 18 December 2011 - 02:07 PM.


#3 Rick Bennett

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 02:42 PM

Guntis,

This whole post strikes me as odd coming from you. You've been a great supporter of Accordance and we listen to every request you've made, but the tone here is unnecessary. Of course we use the app! We know there are many more features that need to be added and plan to do so within time.

A few replies to individual items:

to return to the primary text after amplifying, two-finger swipe to right.
try setting search context to all in main prefs, then use the mk button to navigate search results.
highlighting in Mac needs to be revisited I agree; iOS ported the same code base and so functions the same.

Scott may reply on some of the other items. Overall, this release sought to increaes productivity in bible study through amplification and instant details enhancements. Along the way we decided to make some small steps toward larger readability enhancements like increasing the margins. Even internally some disagreed on the size used so we made a general decision - but are thinking through other options. 1.5 will address other readability features, indeed several of the items you mentioned (more prefs like verse refs, highlighting, hiding toolbars, gestures for navigation and even more). We strongly felt that it was more important to get this release out than delay it further.

We need insightful and even critical feedback, and value it. But please keep in mind that the app has been out for a little less than one year and there are only so many items we can tackle. I hope we've demonstrated our commitment to the iOS platform, and plan to work hard to bring the innovation and solid performance our users have long known on the Mac.

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#4 Ryan Gustason

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 04:25 PM

For the user notes, just click split pane icon on top right, choose the notes icon on top, select your note file. Then it displays your note in parallel with the text. This works for me anyway, although I do agree a 'clickable' note icon like biblereader would be cool. I understand software development costs time and money though, which is why Oak Tree is saving both be porting as much code as possible from the OSX to iOS.

#5 Guntis

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 06:11 PM

"For the user notes, just click split pane icon on top right, choose the notes icon on top, select your note file. Then it displays your note in parallel with the text."
Sorry, this is not solution for me. I know this is possible, but in the parallel window I use commentaries. For me it's too big hassle to turn off commentary just to see my notes, and then switch back to the commentary. There should be pop-up window for that — tap, see commentary and dismiss it — and all your windows remain intact.
“Teach the way of God in Accordance” (Matt 12:14, NIV-Accordance edition)
“Those who live in Accordance (with the Spirit) have their minds set on what the Spirit desires.” (Rom 8:5, NIV-Accordance edition)

#6 Guntis

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 06:19 PM

Guntis,

This whole post strikes me as odd coming from you. You've been a great supporter of Accordance and we listen to every request you've made, but the tone here is unnecessary. Of course we use the app! We know there are many more features that need to be added and plan to do so within time.


Sorry, perhaps my tone is such because you added too many good things, and first 5 minutes I was almost in heaven, but then all my joy came tumbling down when I realised I cannot navigate search results, still cannot open user notes in popup window, and Bible text area on iPhone has shrunken even more… And cherry on all that was difficult navigation with too many extra taps, TOC grid that doesn't fit in one screen although it could (again unnecessary scrolling), difficult module management. I've used BibleReader and I know there are ways to make all these things work very well. My pain is that I really hoped with this version to leave BibleReader only for Latvian Bible, but had to come to sad realisation of truth that I'll have to live with it for quite some time… I'm very disappointed after such high hopes… You were VERY CLOSE to really good version! :(

Edited by Guntis, 18 December 2011 - 06:22 PM.

“Teach the way of God in Accordance” (Matt 12:14, NIV-Accordance edition)
“Those who live in Accordance (with the Spirit) have their minds set on what the Spirit desires.” (Rom 8:5, NIV-Accordance edition)

#7 Guntis

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 06:26 PM

try setting search context to all in main prefs, then use the mk button to navigate search results.


My problem is that if the search list is not as long as iPad's vertical screen, I cannot move verse at the bottom of the screen to the top. That list doesn't scroll. I'm stuck with the references, have to discard search results and manually open them. This is disappointing, because search speed and options is one of the Accordance's strengths. Also, why hide search options on iPad? There's plenty of unused screen real estate to place them all directly available.

Edited by Guntis, 18 December 2011 - 06:27 PM.

“Teach the way of God in Accordance” (Matt 12:14, NIV-Accordance edition)
“Those who live in Accordance (with the Spirit) have their minds set on what the Spirit desires.” (Rom 8:5, NIV-Accordance edition)

#8 Rick Bennett

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 06:37 PM

with context set to all it will allow you to view the desired verse, unless it happened to be the end of Revelation.

Rick Bennett
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#9 Guntis

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 06:42 PM

Go To grid — this one looks strange. It's OS X Lion's theme, perhaps also iOS 5 theme with the grey "cloth" background. Nowhere in Accordance you use grey backgrounds. Perhaps you could use for the grid the same colour as for the main screen's background, and leave empty spaces just darker? I like how in BibleReader book "clusters" in Go To are shaded differently, it helps faster to finding necessary book abbreviation. But perhaps you can come up with something original here?

Secondly, I wish I could pull up / hide split window just by tapping it's handle, it's really handy feature in BibleReader, and I think Logos also had the same approach. Especially on iPhone where there is so little screen real estate — read Bible text, pull up commentary, read it, hide split window and read Bible text again, again pull up split window with the same commentary. Why should I every time use two taps if it can be done with one? Very soon you become a.n.g.r.y. :)

Edited by Guntis, 18 December 2011 - 06:44 PM.

“Teach the way of God in Accordance” (Matt 12:14, NIV-Accordance edition)
“Those who live in Accordance (with the Spirit) have their minds set on what the Spirit desires.” (Rom 8:5, NIV-Accordance edition)

#10 Guntis

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Posted 18 December 2011 - 06:49 PM

with context set to all it will allow you to view the desired verse, unless it happened to be the end of Revelation.

Sorry, I don't like "context set to all", it means tap-tap-tap-tap-tap-tap… I want to get hits list, quickly scan it over and open specific reference in its context, and if necessary, return back and open another reference in its context. Please, make this reality! :)
“Teach the way of God in Accordance” (Matt 12:14, NIV-Accordance edition)
“Those who live in Accordance (with the Spirit) have their minds set on what the Spirit desires.” (Rom 8:5, NIV-Accordance edition)

#11 Sam DeSocio

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Posted 30 December 2011 - 08:08 PM

I going to have to disagree with guntis, these are all good improvements. My hope would be that soon you guys move the ui into two directions one focusing on reading on the iPad and the other focusing on quick search on the iPhone/iPod. The margin is a great improvement. I'm looking forward to 1.5 any timeline?

#12 JonathanHuber

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Posted 30 December 2011 - 08:21 PM

I love the improvements in the 1.4 update, but I agree with Guntis on the margins. On the iphone especially, they really reduce the amount of text displayed. This is magnified in tools with indented text, such as the WBC or Comfort text commentary. The iphone has a small screen already, so don't give away space unnecessarily. Speaking of which, about those ever-present toolbars... :)

Jonathan

Edited by JonathanHuber, 30 December 2011 - 08:21 PM.

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#13 Guntis

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Posted 31 May 2012 - 01:30 PM

In search results hits list — when I tap on the Bible reference, please add contextual menu "Open to here". Very simple solution :)
“Teach the way of God in Accordance” (Matt 12:14, NIV-Accordance edition)
“Those who live in Accordance (with the Spirit) have their minds set on what the Spirit desires.” (Rom 8:5, NIV-Accordance edition)

#14 Scott Knapp

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Posted 31 May 2012 - 02:26 PM

Will a "Show in Context" option work for you?

Attached File  Screen Shot 2012-05-31 at 3.24.19 PM.png   66.77KB   18 downloads

#15 Guntis

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Posted 01 June 2012 - 01:16 PM

Will a "Show in Context" option work for you?

Attached File  Screen Shot 2012-05-31 at 3.24.19 PM.png   66.77KB   18 downloads

Yes, it will work. :-) I hope there will be quick navigation bar at the right side of the search results list? For example, search for David and you'll get 1107 hits in NRSVS. Try to scroll to Revelation… If there would be Bible book navigation bar along the right side of the screen (Gen, Exo, Lev, Psa, Matt, Rev, etc), it would be fast.
“Teach the way of God in Accordance” (Matt 12:14, NIV-Accordance edition)
“Those who live in Accordance (with the Spirit) have their minds set on what the Spirit desires.” (Rom 8:5, NIV-Accordance edition)

#16 Scott Knapp

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Posted 01 June 2012 - 01:54 PM

Yes, it will work. :-) I hope there will be quick navigation bar at the right side of the search results list? For example, search for David and you'll get 1107 hits in NRSVS. Try to scroll to Revelation… If there would be Bible book navigation bar along the right side of the screen (Gen, Exo, Lev, Psa, Matt, Rev, etc), it would be fast.

Your suggestion would be one way to implement quick scanning of the search results. We're considering another approach that better integrates into the current GoTo views. However, it didn't make the feature set for v1.5 but hopefully will get done for v1.6.

#17 Guntis

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Posted 01 June 2012 - 02:04 PM

Will a "Show in Context" option work for you?


How about this screen? Of course, icons can be smaller and text could be added at the bottom, but this way I could choose options without reading buttons. I guess it could be faster…

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Edited by Guntis, 01 June 2012 - 02:10 PM.

“Teach the way of God in Accordance” (Matt 12:14, NIV-Accordance edition)
“Those who live in Accordance (with the Spirit) have their minds set on what the Spirit desires.” (Rom 8:5, NIV-Accordance edition)

#18 Guntis

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Posted 01 June 2012 - 02:08 PM

Your suggestion would be one way to implement quick scanning of the search results. We're considering another approach that better integrates into the current GoTo views. However, it didn't make the feature set for v1.5 but hopefully will get done for v1.6.

This is something similar to Address Book search results list. Alon the right margin there are alphabet letters. Just tap on the one you're interested and you are there. But instead of alphabet letters show Bible book abbreviations which have search results. Good for quick long search results list scrolling. But OK, if you have some better idea, you're welcome! :-)
“Teach the way of God in Accordance” (Matt 12:14, NIV-Accordance edition)
“Those who live in Accordance (with the Spirit) have their minds set on what the Spirit desires.” (Rom 8:5, NIV-Accordance edition)




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