15 replies to this topic

[DWFrancis]

I had downloaded the free sampler to take a look at 10, and thought it looked nice but at the same point in time wasn't anything i was too excited about. I assumed when it came around time to upgrade I would. But after talking with someone on the phone i decided not too. I literally own every single item in the Starter collection, and was told, the $49.99 was for the search engine. I have paid for upgrades in the past but I am not planning on getting this one. If it is required for my Revised Expositor's Bible Commentary upgrade, I may even end up cancelling it. I realized for many people it is well worth the upgrade, I just thought I would put my 2 cents with in on why I am not upgrading. I had at first thought the majority of the Starter collection price was to cover the costs of the copyrighted works, finding out that it is to cover the engine, while just too steep a price for me to have the latest software out there.

-Dan

[JonathanHuber]

I'd like to add a thought to this. We benefit from the fact that Accordance as an app is bundled together with the content that we use in the app, but these really are two different things. Most software companies create software to perform functions, not to generate content. The software is a tool, and we happily buy the software because having good tools allows us to do things we couldn't do without the tools. You don't buy a hammer in order to acquire nails; you buy a hammer to pound the nails. You don't install iTunes because it comes with free music; you install it to play the music. ALL software updates are made for the purpose of improving the tool. This is true for operating systems, web browsers, launch utilities, music players, bible study apps, etc. Accordance 10 is an upgrade to a tool, and it's a fantastic upgrade. Yes, if you already have the content that is included the bundle, you would only be getting the engine. But that's exactly why we all bought Accordance in the first place rather than buying books in print. So to the original poster, I'm not criticizing your decision; you have every right not to upgrade. But nobody who buys the update is getting ripped off; they're getting a better tool. And I think it's well worth the price.

(Disclaimer: I do not work for Accordance.)

[Darin Allen]

Hi Dan,

I can try to clarify a bit. The new Starter Collection offers both a major update to the program and some excellent modern resources (that we in turn pay royalties on). The $49.99 cost covers both, and we priced the upgrade to make sure it was a fantastic value even if you already owned the Starter modules. The upgrade from version 8 to version 9 was $49.99 as well, but it did not include modern resources like the tagged ESV Bible, IVP New Bible Commentary, or Eerdmans Dictionary of the Bible. So yes, the new Starter Collection a fantastic deal for new users who don't own these resources yet, but current customers are not being charged a penny more than for previous "whole number" upgrades, and version 10 is a big step forward.

-Darin

[Rick Bennett]

For what it's worth, none of our resources (modules) will require version 10. In the future certain features of them may require the newer version, but the resource itself will work (ex: audio links in Mounce or Pratico-Van Pelt require version 9.x or higher). EBCr will not have any of these advanced features.

Also remember that this one-time upgrade includes all future 10.x updates, which historically is 2 years of free updates and a myriad of new features.

[DWFrancis]

Just a wee bit disappointed owning the works and getting no discount, it;s not like physical books that I can give to someone else. And admittedly i have purchased the same resource in different programs… It's just frustrating when in effect you are being force to repurchase the same resources again to get a software upgrade. I will have to think it over… I will not deny it is an absolute fantastic deal for everyone who never purchased the resources. Indeed Eerdmans dictionary is one of those items i have purchased multiple times… First hard cover, then Olivetree and again with you…. I never regretted getting what i consider the best one volume dictionary out there… I suppose i was just a little shocked to hear there was no discount credit for previously owned items.

-Dan

[Ken Simpson]

Hi Dan,
not completely clear if you get what we're asking.

The upgrade fee is $49.99. That includes the update to the Application - and is our standard major revision upgrade fee. Along with this upgrade comes a number of included modules - some of which you may have paid for in the past. I already had the ESVS - for example - a $30 value. These are included with the starter pack. Any other module you already own, you do not need to upgrade. You can use them straight from your current Accordance install.

IF you decide you wish to upgrade even further - say to the Essentials package - then you may be paying for some modules "twice". And you need to do the maths to see if you can justify the cost for the extra modules. That is a personal decision, but you only need to make that if you are going further than the Starter pack (IMHO).

The way I think about the Starter upgrade is that the upgrade is $49.99, what we have paid for a major upgrade for some years, but now included in that are a bunch of free modules - some of which I already own, so anything extra I get in the Starter package is a bonus, and even if I have everything already, it's a brilliant upgrade.

As far as I have seen so far, if you own modules already, they will still all work in Accordance 10.

Edited by Ken Simpson, 29 August 2012 - 02:23 AM.

[DWFrancis]

I am not saying anything will stop working just other companies look at what you own and discount you the licensing fees you have already paid for. All i was asking is why can there not be application only upgrade? And i have been using accordance since version 3 and never remember an upgrade costing more than $29.95 (perhaps my memory is failing me there). I know that if i have purchased volumes in a set in Logos i can call them up or email them and say… I own these already they examine my account and make the adjustments. For example I had order their 1000 biblical images previously, it was a core component of their 4.0 software and deducted the difference. I in no way expect a dollar for dollar discount but what would be nice is to be discounted the license fee that is going to the publishers out of that $49.99, unless someone can tell me what value I am getting additional licenses for the same work in Accordance. It is true i use my phone iPad and laptop, but i am only one user and can no more use multiple copies of the Erdman's dictionary or the IVP-NBC, or the ESVs i still maintain paying duplicate costs for additional licenses we already own makes no sense whatsoever.

-Dan

Edited by DWFrancis, 29 August 2012 - 01:49 AM.

[Jonathan C. Borland]

It's kind of like working all day but still only getting one denarius. But at least we got to play with our previously-purchased Accordance modules for 11 more hours than everyone else, right?

[Chuck Schneider]

For me, it's like getting a new pair of glasses.

In terms of vision, the stuff I've seen for years has now become crisper, clearer and easier to see.

In terms of comfort, the glasses aren't as awkward or heavy and they have new features to lessen the strain.

(edit: lessen, not lesson!)

Edited by Chuck Schneider, 29 August 2012 - 07:42 AM.

[Alex H.]

I think what Rick and Ken are saying, if I understand correctly, is that you are only paying for the engine upgrade and getting the 'Starter Pack' for free, as a bonus. Previously you paid for the engine upgrade and nothing (or very little) came free. Is this correct? If so, a discount for currently owned resources is not relevant since you're not really paying for them.

[Julie Falling]

Alex - That's a good, concise way to look at it. Version 10, just the engine, gives me features that I have wanted for some time, and some I hadn't even thought of. Worth every penny. Because one of the upgrade options was a good deal for me, I didn't go for just the program upgrade.

Dan, no one is forced to upgrade. Some may want to wait for Version 11. The program will still work. All the modules will continue to work in Version 9. Skipping a single upgrade will not get a user into a mess later on.

Many of us think Version 10, even just the engine, is worth the price. I also look at the great support from the Accordance folks, the free iOS, the free podcasts. I'm so grateful to the people who do the work and do it so well. I'm grateful, too, that such a powerful tool is available at all. Version 10 is not just a tweaking of Version 9 - it really is an major upgrade. I cannot help but wonder how many man-hours went into development and testing.

I upgrade my OS yearly without hesitation, even when we had to buy a disc and it was more expensive. I upgrade my music software (Finale) yearly, too, and it doesn't get used nearly as much as Accordance. I've always looked at upgrades as just part of owning a computer and software. If there are programs I find less useful, I stop upgrading and just let them die a natural death.

[As an aside, I'm tech support for some Mac families. (Scary, isn't it? The closest Apple Store is 90 minutes away in Knoxville.) One didn't want to pay for OS upgrades. Didn't want to upgrade the old eMac, either. He bought a new iMac and went from 10.4 to Lion. If there had been a computer or OS upgrade in-between, he would have been OK. (Some do that with Accordance.) But because he had gotten SO far behind, Migration Assistant wouldn't work. He had to move everything manually. I think the process went on for months. I'm not sure it's finished at this point. It has been pretty nightmarish. You can be sure that he will never do that again!]

[Darin Allen]

Part of the confusion may be that the Starter Collection is designed both for new users and also for current users upgrading to the latest version of Accordance. It has always been this way, but in the past we listed them under different names (i.e. "Starter Collection" for new customers, "Upgrade from 8 to 9" for current customers).

To provide some additional insight, we had two goals when planning the new Starter Collection: 1) Add more/better modules and 2) Offer one low price for everyone.

Add More/Better Modules
Our previous Starter Collection (for Accordance 9) offered the Accordance 9 application, but did not include any modern Bibles, Commentaries, or Dictionaries. For this new Starter Collection, we decided to add a modern Bible (tagged ESV), a modern commentary that covers every book of the Bible (IVP New Bible Commentary), a modern dictionary (Eerdmans Dictionary of the Bible), and a tagged original language text (GNT Textus Receptus). This lets new users try out a range of Bible study tools in order to get the full Accordance experience. For current users who are buying the new Starter Collection in order to upgrade to version 10, these resources are simply icing on the cake if they don’t own these modules yet.

One Low Price
Even though we added all these great new modules, we aren’t charging more for the upgrade. Accordance's "engine only" upgrade from version 8 to 9 was also $49.99, so we didn't add these additional modules into the cost. We, of course, pay royalties on them, but we are not passing that cost on to the customer. So if it helps to think about it in these terms, it means you really aren’t paying for them again if you already own them.

For Accordance 9, new users could buy the Starter Collection for $69.99. Current users had a tiered pricing structure. For Accordance 8 users, the upgrade was $49.99; for Accordance 7 users, it was $59.99, and so on. In short, $49.99 was the lowest price we offered. For Accordance 10, we decided to simplify things by moving to a single price point. And even though we added more/better modules, we went with the lowest price point we previously offered—$49.99 for everyone. And of course, full-time ministers, students, and professors pay even less with their discounts.

So for news users, the Starter Collection includes more and costs less than before. For current users, the upgrade includes more and costs the same as before. Even if you are a current user who owns all the modules in the new Starter Collection, you still aren’t paying a penny more than you would have paid for the "engine only" upgrade from Accordance 8 to Accordance 9. We really tried to offer everyone a great deal, and while new users may get an especially good deal, we made sure that wasn’t at the expense of our current users.

I hope this provides some insight into the method behind our madness. We worked very hard to make sure that all of our new Collections were a great deal for both new customers and current customers looking to upgrade.

-Darin

Edited by Darin Allen, 29 August 2012 - 01:20 PM.

[DWFrancis]

I appreciate the email and I will simply bite the bullet, it;s my Scottish heritage makes me question anything that seems a higher price than should be.

-Dan

[Ken Simpson]

My scottish heritage loves it, because I got Eerdman's "for free"! (Glasgow, via Newry Ireland, to Australia (Great, great, great grandparents))

[DWFrancis]

LOL, yes but i got nothing free (there were some original language texts that downloaded in easy install, but I don't read hebrew or greek, so they do me no good)… but i am happy for all who got free texts…

-Dan

[Fr. Rich]

Now is the time and the reason, to start learning Greek and Hebrew.:-)