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#1 Denes House

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Posted 27 May 2005 - 07:24 PM

A friend who uses LOGOS says that there is a feature that ties in with MS Word that automatically tags Scripture references when you type them in Word, and if you click on the tag, it pulls up a menu that allows you to paste the whole verse, or a complete citation, or one of a variety of formats automatically into the text. That sounds like a nifty feature to me, is it one that could be implemented in Accordance?
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#2 Helen Brown

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Posted 09 June 2005 - 07:04 PM

Yes, we hope soon to release a "Widget" for Tiger that will work in a similar way.
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#3 Ed Cross

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Posted 29 June 2005 - 04:19 PM

A number of my Windows based Bible programs give great flexibility in copy/pasting verses like the tool that Logos includes. Do you think that the "widget" that you are working on will allow for a format similar to the one below with verse citation (if the position of the citation could be selected as either before passage or after this would be great) and then the passage with the verse numbers included (they could be delineated with braces or in superscript)? Also, any time frame as to the widgets availability?

Genesis 1:1-Gen 1:5 (1)In the beginning God created the heaven and the earth. (2)And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the Spirit of God moved upon the face of the waters. (3)And God said, Let there be light: and there was light. (4)And God saw the light, that it was good: and God divided the light from the darkness. (5)And God called the light Day, and the darkness he called Night. And the evening and the morning were the first day.

Also, just for your information. I received the New Quickverse for Mac, but it is certainly less than what was advertised. They claimed "the most advanced copy features", but it is no improvement over Accordance, I still can't do with it what I can do even with the Quickverses Windows version.

"With the most advanced copy features, QuickVerse Mac has the ability to copy small or large ranges of text or scripture, and users can pull data directly from QuickVerse Mac into word processing systems. Maps, pictures, illustrations, charts, and graphs can also be easily imported into your word processing or desktop publishing application with no restrictions."

The claim that it "can pull data directly into word processing" is a misnomer, all it does is copy to the clipboard and then you manually paste into your document. It also claimed a verse widget, see below, but when I confronted their tech support I was told it was still in development. After I got off the phone with them they removed the following paragraph from their website.

"Distinctive "Tiger" Features - QuickVerse Mac incorporates at least two new elements found distinctively in Tiger (Mac OS X 10.4, also known as "Tiger"). 1) A "Verse Widget" to find any Book/Chapter/Verse in any Bible translation, and 2) Spotlight links for searching through any/all QuickVerse Mac books."

I am some what confused as to why there is such flexibility in the copy/paste options on the Windows platform, even on the free programs, but on the Mac side the options are so limited. Is it just to hard to code for the Mac?

#4 Joel Brown

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Posted 29 June 2005 - 04:33 PM

A number of my Windows based Bible programs give great flexibility in copy/pasting verses like the tool that Logos includes. Do you think that the "widget" that you are working on will allow for a format similar to the one below with verse citation (if the position of the citation could be selected as either before passage or after this would be great) and then the passage with the verse numbers included (they could be delineated with braces or in superscript)? Also, any time frame as to the widgets availability?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


The widget will have a number of customization options for the output of the text. Currently, it is simply planned to have 2 options, one would be like a direct copy from Accordance, taking whatever format you currently use, (essentially like you had opened accordance, found the references, selected them and hit copy). There is also going to be an option to "Copy as Citation" similar to Accordance's Copy as Citation command. That is what is planned for release, though if there is great demand, perhaps further options would be added in later versions.

Sorry, can't give a timeframe because there are too many unknown variables. It is definitely coming, though.
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#5 Joe Weaks

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Posted 29 June 2005 - 06:47 PM

But let's all be clear. A Widget to look up Accordance verses (and even copy them to the clipboard in various formats) is a FAR CRY from the autopasting functionality that folks are talking about and now perhaps even anticipating.
This type of inter-application data sharing is VERY easy to code on the Mac platform, once the developer has opened up an API for accessing the data. In other words, if Oak Tree did the work to add an Apple Event call to the Accordance app (basically, a behind the scenes message: "Hello Mr. Accordance App. Could you please tell me the text for 'John 3:3-5'?"), 3rd party folks with expertise in these areas (myself along with others) can go crazy coming up with solutions for custom text pasting into Pages, Word, Open Office, Power Point, Applescript libraries, Automator actions. There are quite a few users using my InterCord utility, which can do alot of this, but it has to bring Accordance to the front and copy and paste using the GUI. What we're looking for is a behind the scenes call, the likes of which the Widget will be making to the Accordance app. Whether or not this small change will open up other possibilities remains to be seen. Quick paste... quick display... the sky becomes the limit.
But, "opening the door" for such calls would take some programming time, time not deemed a customer priority by the Oak Tree developers for many years running now.

#6 Joel Brown

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Posted 29 June 2005 - 07:22 PM

Features in strong (possible) consideration or already implemented include automatic insertion of the verses into the document and taking the selection, automatically looking that up and inserting it.

In essence, the widget should be able to do everything you all are asking for, and hopefully more. No 100% guarantees, but I'm just telling you the things that are planned.
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#7 Joe Weaks

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Posted 29 June 2005 - 07:51 PM

Features in strong (possible) consideration or already implemented include automatic insertion of the verses into the document and taking the selection, automatically looking that up and inserting it.


I'd happily stand corrected, but Joel, you're glossing over alot of details. To my knowledge, a Widget doesn't have access to selected text in the frontmost application by default. The easiest way to accomplish this might make it work in Services-capable applications. Holding my breath.
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#8 Ed Cross

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Posted 29 June 2005 - 08:49 PM

[quote name='Joel Brown' date='Jun 29 2005, 04:33 PM'][quote name='Ed Cross' date='Jun 29 2005, 05:19 PM']A number of my Windows based Bible programs give great flexibility in copy/pasting verses like the tool that Logos includes. Do you think that the

The widget will have a number of customization options for the output of the text. Currently, it is simply planned to have 2 options, one would be like a direct copy from Accordance, taking whatever format you currently use, (essentially like you had opened accordance, found the references, selected them and hit copy). There is also going to be an option to "Copy as Citation" similar to Accordance's Copy as Citation command. That is what is planned for release, though if there is great demand, perhaps further options would be added in later versions.

Sorry, can't give a timeframe because there are too many unknown variables. It is definitely coming, though.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[/quote]

Joel,

If this is all that the widget is going to do, is give us the same copy/paste function that already exists as you mention above, it will be of no use to me whatsoever. If it had been otherwise I would not have even looked at the New Quickverse Mac. These flexible copy/paste options are standard fare in even the free Windows programs. I'm currently having to run Bible programs on my Windows PC using Remote Connection so I can bring the formatted data over to my Mac, which means my Accordance, MacBible and now Quickverse for Mac sit unused. If someone on the Mac end doesn't incorporate more flexibility in the copy/paste functions soon, it looks like we'll just have to wait and see if Logos can bring this basic functionality to the Mac Bible software arena this December.

Ed Cross

#9 Ed Cross

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Posted 09 July 2005 - 06:13 PM

I am glad to report that I've had some good dialog with David Lang regarding the Copy/Paste functions and the planned widget. I shared a number of screen shots from my Windows Bible apps functionality in this regard. So I am fairly confident that he will be working on something, exactly what or when I am not certain.

I would also report that the Online Bible for Mac Beta came out this past week. Low and behold the Copy/Paste options are there, so I can at least temporarily bring the Bible verses with the right formatting into my sermon prep without having to manually mess with the format. It is supposed to have a Copy Verses function from the Services menu, but I've yet been able to get that functionality to work within any of my word processing apps.

QuickVerse for Mac Black Box edition went back this week. I talked with their tech support and got the typical, "that didn't make it into this edition" reply. I emailed them with concerns over what their website said the program could do versus what it actually could do, but never got any response. They have got to be one of the most unresponsive companies around.

I am hoping we will see some thing soon from Accordance!

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#10 Ed Cross

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Posted 16 November 2005 - 10:01 PM

David Lang had mentioned the possibility of improved Copy/Paste function in version 7, is this still a possiblity? Any idea as to timing?

I am looking at selling my Logo's Scholar's Silver Edition and switching over, but really need better Copy/Paste functions.

Pastor Ed Cross




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