Jump to content


Photo

Translation Alternative Wanted

translation text module

  • Please log in to reply
47 replies to this topic

#41 Daniel R

Daniel R

    Silver

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 102 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Accordance Version:11.x

Posted 03 February 2016 - 10:37 AM

Dave Brunn is an expert on Bible translation. I recommend one re-orients one's view of what Bible translation really is in practice and the limitations that educated people have on the translation projects they work on. 

 

https://youtu.be/BlpNgLhD1vA


  • Emanuel Cardona likes this

#42 Emanuel Cardona

Emanuel Cardona

    Gold

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 257 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Interests:Study, learn, live, and teach the written Word of God, the Bible [Estudiar, aprender, vivir y enseñar la Palabra escrita de Dios, la Biblia] ▪ Biblical hermeneutics [Hermenéutica bíblica] ▪ Biblical languages [Lenguas bíblicas] ▪ Theology [Teología] ▪ Listen to faithful expositions of Scripture [Escuchar exposiciones fieles de la Escritura] ▪ Learn from others who have undertaken all the labors necessary to gain a thorough grasp of the meaning of Scripture [Aprender de otros que han emprendido todos los trabajos necesarios para adquirir una comprensión cabal del significado de la Escritura] ▪ https://hermeneutics.stackexchange.com/ ▪ https://christianity.stackexchange.com/ ▪ https://www.ibiblio.org/bgreek/forum/
  • Accordance Version:11.x
  • Platforms:Windows, iOS

Posted 03 February 2016 - 11:31 AM

Adding to Daniel R's post: https://www.youtube....h?v=MxwYK2duyPg


In the love of God that is in Christ Jesus [En el amor de Dios que es en Cristo Jesús],


Emanuel Cardona

 

 

Sola Scriptura (Regula credendi, Norma normans non normata) ~ Sola fide ~ Solus Christus ~ Sola gratia ~ Soli Deo gloria

 

In the New American Standard Bible, 2 Timothy 2:15 reads, “Be diligent to present yourself approved to God as a workman who does not need to be ashamed, accurately handling the word of truth.”

 

En la Reina-Valera 1960, 2 Timoteo 2:15 lee, “Procura con diligencia presentarte a Dios aprobado, como obrero que no tiene de qué avergonzarse, que usa bien la palabra de verdad.”

 

_______________

 

Accordance for Windows:

1)  Accordance Software Version: 

          11.1.6
     Operating System Version: 

          Windows Vista Home Premium
     Model: 

          HP Pavilion dv6000 (GA378UA#ABA)

     Processor: 

          Intel Core Dual Core CPU     T2450  @ 2 GHz

     Memory: 

          4 GB
     System Type: 

          32-bit


#43 Obed Benyah

Obed Benyah

    Member

  • Active Members
  • Pip
  • 10 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Montana
  • Accordance Version:10.x

Posted 04 February 2016 - 01:28 PM

First of all, my apologies to Dr. Brown and the forum for moving outside the guidelines.

I'm not a "frequent flyer" on forums. It's been quite some time since I even visited this site.

I failed to remember the guidelines.

I'm truly sorry for the oversight on my part.

 

My original question has been answered very well. It's become very evident that there is no alternative translation available in Accordance that conforms to my study interests. I was really hoping to find such a version, perhaps from an individual on the forum. Many good suggestions have been provided - and I want to thank each one who has offered them. Dr. Everett Fox's work comes the closest to meeting my needs, but it only involves his one volume on The Torah. That's simply not sufficient for me at this point.

 

As noted in a previous post I have begun work on a new version for my purposes that may one day be made available in Accordance. I am creating a personal note for every verse in Scripture within my Accordance program. I have just finished the first draft of 2 Samuel this morning and will be posting it to my website soon. All of this is indeed a "work in progress". I make no claim that it's a "finished product". Nor would I dare to suggest it's without errors and/or misconceptions. By the kindness and compassions of YAHWEH I will continue.

 

May I suggest to the moderator that this topic on the forum be closed?

It has served the purpose for which I intended it.

 

In His Kindness,

Obed Benyah


He has explained to you, oh man, what is good, and what YAHWEH requires of you: 

- Do justice, 

- Love mercy, and 

- Walk humbly with your Elohim.

                                                  Micah 6.8


#44 Unix

Unix

    Silver

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 189 posts
  • Twitter:mcyklist
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:inter/multidisciplinary humanities
  • Interests:Hebrew, "Gnosticism", Anglican books, (Environmental and a bit of Ethnological) History, particular interest in texts copyrighted 1952-2009, Autumn '16 Greek. christianforums.com, unorthodoxchristian.freeforums.net Purchased Scrivener as both Win and Mac versions early June and a used Macbook Pro June 13., HDDRegenerator.net on July 17. 2015
  • Accordance Version:10.x
  • Platforms:Mac OS X, Windows

Posted 05 February 2016 - 12:05 AM

The PDF-document http://www.newtestam...-David-Webb.pdf by David Webb p. 52f has a point: In passages that have detailed legal matters, use of strong visual imagery or figurative prophetic language, English Bible versions - especially the ones with low reading level - increase the word count, even more so if there's theological language.
The PDF by Webb compares the word count of only a few versions and compares the word counts to the the NRSV. I did a Text Comparison and noticed that the 2004 Good News Translation 3rd Edition UK-English 66-book Bible uses many more words than the NRSV to convey the same things in Eph 1. Now, the original 39-book Old Testament team that produced the 1976 Good News Bible, comprised of 5 more translators besides Bratcher.
So I wanted to find an Old Testament example to see if the GNT uses more words: Joel 1 doesn't have a higher word count.

An example of when the 2004 3rd Edition GNT (compared to the NRSV) increases the word count in the Old Testament, is: Jer 8:3-12 except vv. 6b, 8.
And in Dt 12 it uses more words in some instances, with just slightly opaque formal equivalency, have a look at the way in which the translation wants to bring out points and focus in verses 30 and 11f.


yesterday was 2 years since I returned from an archaeological trip to Turkey. /Apr 16. 2016 A bit of interest in Akkadian or Babylonian. /Apr. 2016
Besides my Macbook referenced below I have a few Windows, among the toughest I have are: 4GB W7 i3 3110 3rd gen Ivy Bridge (since it's W7 and huge battery) | 8GB W10 AMD FX-7600P (since it's AMD:s best laptop CPU - I LOVE AMD) it has the slightly overkill AMD R7 270DX 2GB graphics, bought new on Oct. 30. (tomorrow from 
Örebro by train) 2015 returned item so lower bargain price not on a sale. My desktop has the excellent value for money G2030 CPU Ivy Bridge
Facebook: https://www.facebook...100009160762403 (see also my Twitter).
Was on a vacation in Germany by car July 21. - Aug. 1. relaxing, evangelizing a little, while studying.
Going to teach myself the asq -programming language years later on. /June 16.-Oct 10. 2015-Apr. 16. 2016
As 10.10 is not working as well for me (the competitor software to work on it yet) ... /July 9.-20., Oct. 10. 2015 ... I'm installing OS X 10.11 El Capitan in June 2016 on my 2007 Macbook Pro with motherboard changed when it was 4 years old, disks changed as well: main drive 256 GB SSD, two new batteries. The 6 GB RAM and the two USB 3.0 ports for it (the latter through ExpressCard slot) just arrived this afternoon. /June 17. 2015

#45 revtim

revtim

    Gold

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPipPip
  • 245 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Butterfield, MN
  • Interests:discipling, loving my wife and family, the Bible, preaching, & technology
  • Accordance Version:11.x
  • Platforms:Mac OS X, Windows, iOS

Posted 05 February 2016 - 12:45 PM

Obed,

 

You wrote,  "I have just finished the first draft of 2 Samuel this morning and will be posting it to my website soon" what might your website be? I would be interested in reading your "notes".


In Christ,

Tim Hall


#46 bnelson

bnelson

    Member

  • Active Members
  • Pip
  • 17 posts

Posted 09 February 2016 - 12:30 PM

revtim... Here is Obed's site http://amarel.com/



#47 Unix

Unix

    Silver

  • Active Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 189 posts
  • Twitter:mcyklist
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:inter/multidisciplinary humanities
  • Interests:Hebrew, "Gnosticism", Anglican books, (Environmental and a bit of Ethnological) History, particular interest in texts copyrighted 1952-2009, Autumn '16 Greek. christianforums.com, unorthodoxchristian.freeforums.net Purchased Scrivener as both Win and Mac versions early June and a used Macbook Pro June 13., HDDRegenerator.net on July 17. 2015
  • Accordance Version:10.x
  • Platforms:Mac OS X, Windows

Posted 11 May 2016 - 07:01 PM

Obed Benyah,

I see that You still follow this thread!
I've been wanting to hint You about a Bible version which I since before use especially for Ps 127, Mt and Tit (that I remember well that I use it for). Looking at my newly refined up-to-date reading list/priorities I also use it for:
Prv
Is 1-2
Col 2:10, 3:6
Jas 1:13-20
1 Pt  2:13-19
Apocalypse when reading the Oxford Bible Commentary (otherwise may perhaps sometimes use other versions).
... the version is the 1985 NJB. I notice as I read for example Tit almost a Week ago that it's more verbose than other versions. In Mt it uses a manuscript with more words.
Two and a half days ago I just managed to get a divisive downpayment made on my Complete Biblical Library Old and New Testament sets - it's on a sale right now in WS, until early next Week! Many should take a look!


yesterday was 2 years since I returned from an archaeological trip to Turkey. /Apr 16. 2016 A bit of interest in Akkadian or Babylonian. /Apr. 2016
Besides my Macbook referenced below I have a few Windows, among the toughest I have are: 4GB W7 i3 3110 3rd gen Ivy Bridge (since it's W7 and huge battery) | 8GB W10 AMD FX-7600P (since it's AMD:s best laptop CPU - I LOVE AMD) it has the slightly overkill AMD R7 270DX 2GB graphics, bought new on Oct. 30. (tomorrow from 
Örebro by train) 2015 returned item so lower bargain price not on a sale. My desktop has the excellent value for money G2030 CPU Ivy Bridge
Facebook: https://www.facebook...100009160762403 (see also my Twitter).
Was on a vacation in Germany by car July 21. - Aug. 1. relaxing, evangelizing a little, while studying.
Going to teach myself the asq -programming language years later on. /June 16.-Oct 10. 2015-Apr. 16. 2016
As 10.10 is not working as well for me (the competitor software to work on it yet) ... /July 9.-20., Oct. 10. 2015 ... I'm installing OS X 10.11 El Capitan in June 2016 on my 2007 Macbook Pro with motherboard changed when it was 4 years old, disks changed as well: main drive 256 GB SSD, two new batteries. The 6 GB RAM and the two USB 3.0 ports for it (the latter through ExpressCard slot) just arrived this afternoon. /June 17. 2015

#48 Obed Benyah

Obed Benyah

    Member

  • Active Members
  • Pip
  • 10 posts
  • Gender:Male
  • Location:Montana
  • Accordance Version:10.x

Posted 12 May 2016 - 09:18 AM

Unix:

 

Thank you for your input on this topic. I'll take a look at the version you recommend.

 

I've been disappointed by most version I've encountered. As a result I've decided to "build" my own version of the text by using a variety of inputs from multiple resources. I'm not a "scholar". I'm also not a "grammarian" or an English specialist. And I certainly do not have an in depth understanding of Hebrew. 

 

However, I am very serious about trying to understand properly what YAHWEH has written in His Word. This should not be as difficult as it now is. It should, in my opinion, be possible for ANY PERSON to seek for a deep understanding of YAHWEH's Word - AND FIND IT! After all, it's is His promise to us that this will happen. So the question becomes, 'How does one do this?' I've taken an approach that uses the best resources I can find to help me understand what the words mean. I then look carefully at the context to determine the best understanding of that word. I then write/type that understanding into an updated version of the text. As a result I now have all of The New Covenant reworked and 12 books of The Old Covenant reworked into a text that includes a number of the missing elements that I personally believe should be within it. 

 

These updated texts are available on my website, amarel.com. They're all in PDF format. They can be downloaded for free. If you want to see the results please go to the website and review them for yourself. Notes are included right within the text column so you don't have to go searching for them. The format is different than most other formats also since I don't treat the verses as "paragraphs", but instead as "sections" with a different pattern for the statements within each "section". The text within the verses is not simply run from one statement into the next. The idea is to separate the concepts, in some cases for special emphasis.

 

There's one other very significant discovery that's included in The Old Covenant texts that does not appear in any other text I've seen to date. It is the use of the aleph-tau construct את. This construct is left out of virtually every other text. It's typically identified as "a marker for the direct object of a verb". That, it turns out, is not correct. It has a very special purpose. That purpose has been identified, even by James Strong - yet it is virtually ignored today. It's the concept of "self or selfsame". The function of this construct is to add emphasis to a word or phrase within the text. My version now has this function restored, at least as well as I can understand it's role at this point. My way of representing it may not be "perfect" but at least it provides a new way of understanding this vital element of YAHWEH's Word. He does NOTHING without a purpose. And He does not make errors. Thus, if this were a "marker for the direct object of a verb" it should appear with EVERY verb. It does not! But when it's understood as a means of adding emphasis to the text at certain points It reveals an entirely new and deeply rich meaning to portions of the text. 

 

I've been blessed to have another Accordance user and member of this forum assist me in getting the text formatted to use within Accordance. This is a work in progress yet, and not quite ready for release to other users of Accordance. However, in time I hope to make it available to others so you can put in in parallel with any other Accordance text and explore the differences.

 

I'm no longer looking for "an alternative text". I'm doing my best to create one that restores some missing items to the text and corrects certain errors that also exist. It will never be "perfect"because I'm simply a human being. But I do hope it will honor YAHWEH by representing His Word as faithfully as possible by someone who is not a "specialist". This should be something any person on earth can do if they set their heart to do it.

 

Thank you for your kind consideration and recommendation of this topic.

 

In His Compassion and Love,

 Obed Benyah


He has explained to you, oh man, what is good, and what YAHWEH requires of you: 

- Do justice, 

- Love mercy, and 

- Walk humbly with your Elohim.

                                                  Micah 6.8






Also tagged with one or more of these keywords: translation, text, module

0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users