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Comparing NA with TR - missing phrase not recognized


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#1 Elijah

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Posted 13 September 2014 - 03:55 AM

I'm not sure why the the text comparison in John 3:13 doesn't recognize the additional " ὁ ὢν ἐν τῷ οὐρανῷ" in TR.

Attached File  compare.png   25.93KB   0 downloads

Shouldn't there be a red marker in the NA text?

 



#2 Julia Falling

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Posted 13 September 2014 - 08:54 AM

The colors of the markings may vary depending on how you've set up your preferences.  However, you are right that it is not displaying properly.  I tried the same thing and got the expected highlighting.

 

Attached File  Screen Shot 2014-09-13 at 9.46.33 AM.jpg   111.73KB   0 downloads

 

Maybe someone else can help you.  The ουρανον that is marked in your screen shot in both texts is your highlighting, right?  You might want to check your Compare Text preferences.


Edited by Julie Falling, 13 September 2014 - 09:10 AM.

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#3 Elijah

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Posted 13 September 2014 - 10:14 AM

It seems to depend on the selected text. With the NA28 the comparison seems to work, but would have expected a red marker in NA28 where the text is "missing".

Attached File  compare2.png   20.69KB   0 downloads


Edited by Elijah, 13 September 2014 - 10:19 AM.


#4 דָנִיאֶל

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Posted 13 September 2014 - 11:09 AM

Yep it seems to depend upon the pair compared. But I cannot from that alone work out what I think is broken.

GNT-T or GNT28-T -> GNT-TRS broken

GNT-T or GNT28-T -> GNT-TR works

GNT-T or GNT28-T -> GNT-TIS works

GNT-T or GNT28-T -> GNT-WH works but there is nothing to show as there is no difference.

 

Perhaps someone can use this info to progress the issue.

 

Thx

D


Sola lingua bona est lingua mortua

ἡ μόνη ἀγαθὴ γλῶσσα γλῶσσα νεκρὰ ἐστιν

lišanu ēdēnitu damqitu lišanu mītu

 

"Du stammst vom Herrn Adam und der Herrin Eva ab", sagte Aslan. "Und das ist zugleich Ehre genug, um das Häupt des ärmsten Bettlers zu erheben, und genug, um die Schultern des größten Kaisers auf Erden zu beugen. Sei zufrieden." Aslan, Die Chroniken von Narnia, Prinz Kaspian von Narnia. CS Lewis. Übersetzt von Wolfgang Holbein und Christian Rendel.

 

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#5 Julia Falling

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Posted 13 September 2014 - 11:38 AM

Might there be some behind-the-scenes difference between the tagging of the GNT-TR and the GNT-TRS?


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#6 דָנִיאֶל

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Posted 13 September 2014 - 11:53 AM

I do/did suspect a tagging issue of some kind but I don't think that's all there is to it. GNT-TR is not tagged so I suspect in that case the comparison algorithm will have to do something else. But I don't quite see why tagging should enter into as you really want to compare and find the differences that the user actually sees rather than diffing tagging. So I'm really not sure - my official diagnosis is that it looks wrong and I don't understand. :)

 

Thx

D
 


Sola lingua bona est lingua mortua

ἡ μόνη ἀγαθὴ γλῶσσα γλῶσσα νεκρὰ ἐστιν

lišanu ēdēnitu damqitu lišanu mītu

 

"Du stammst vom Herrn Adam und der Herrin Eva ab", sagte Aslan. "Und das ist zugleich Ehre genug, um das Häupt des ärmsten Bettlers zu erheben, und genug, um die Schultern des größten Kaisers auf Erden zu beugen. Sei zufrieden." Aslan, Die Chroniken von Narnia, Prinz Kaspian von Narnia. CS Lewis. Übersetzt von Wolfgang Holbein und Christian Rendel.

 

Accordance Configurations :
 
Mac : 2009 27" iMac                 Windows : MSI GE72 7RE Apache Pro laptop
      Intel Core Duo                          Intel i7 Kabylake
      12GB RAM                                16GB RAM
      Accordance 11.2.4 and 12                Accordance 12
      OSX 10.11 (Yosemite)                    Win 10 Home x64

 

 


#7 Helen Brown

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Posted 13 September 2014 - 11:54 AM

The TRS is tagged only with Strong's numbers, intended for the non-specialist. It probably cannot be usefully used in comparison.


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#8 Elijah

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Posted 13 September 2014 - 12:50 PM

I tried the comparison of two random bible translations that don't have tagging at all. Even with those texts the highlighting works.

Attached File  random texts.png   326.86KB   0 downloads

So I don't quite understand why with some texts it works and with it doesn't.

 



#9 Julia Falling

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Posted 13 September 2014 - 01:09 PM

I do/did suspect a tagging issue of some kind but I don't think that's all there is to it. GNT-TR is not tagged so I suspect in that case the comparison algorithm will have to do something else. But I don't quite see why tagging should enter into as you really want to compare and find the differences that the user actually sees rather than diffing tagging. So I'm really not sure - my official diagnosis is that it looks wrong and I don't understand. :)

 

Thx

D
 

 

Hey, Daniel –

 

The GNT-TR is fully tagged.  It has all the parsing and even works as the base text for the interlinear.  In this case, I guess the S GNT-TRS must indicate just Strong's.  The GNT-TR gives no indication in its name that it is in fact, fully tagged. (The GNT-TRS works with the interlinear, too.  Hmm.  It may have some holes in it somewhere – i only checked a couple of verses.)  Since the Gk in the GNT-TR & the GNT-TRS is identical (see the About This Text blurbs), it's not really an issue.  We can just use the GNT-TR for Compare Text — we know from Elijah's shot that the GNT-TRS doesn't work there.  

 

By the way, when I organized my Library, I put the GNT-TRS and the GNT-NA in a folder at the bottom of my Greek texts so I wouldn't keep tripping over them or opening them by mistake.


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#10 דָנִיאֶל

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Posted 13 September 2014 - 01:21 PM

Oh ok - I had read more into the meaning of the S than I should have. Thanx for that.

What's GNT-NA ? Is that an older Nestle-Aland ?

 

thx

D


Sola lingua bona est lingua mortua

ἡ μόνη ἀγαθὴ γλῶσσα γλῶσσα νεκρὰ ἐστιν

lišanu ēdēnitu damqitu lišanu mītu

 

"Du stammst vom Herrn Adam und der Herrin Eva ab", sagte Aslan. "Und das ist zugleich Ehre genug, um das Häupt des ärmsten Bettlers zu erheben, und genug, um die Schultern des größten Kaisers auf Erden zu beugen. Sei zufrieden." Aslan, Die Chroniken von Narnia, Prinz Kaspian von Narnia. CS Lewis. Übersetzt von Wolfgang Holbein und Christian Rendel.

 

Accordance Configurations :
 
Mac : 2009 27" iMac                 Windows : MSI GE72 7RE Apache Pro laptop
      Intel Core Duo                          Intel i7 Kabylake
      12GB RAM                                16GB RAM
      Accordance 11.2.4 and 12                Accordance 12
      OSX 10.11 (Yosemite)                    Win 10 Home x64

 

 


#11 Elijah

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Posted 13 September 2014 - 01:25 PM

ok I didn't really check the difference between GNT-TRS and GNT-TR. With GNT-TR it seems to work.

I found a bug however when switching between different Texts:

 1. Select GNT-T on the left (Joh 3:13)

 2. Select GNT-TR on the right

 3. Enable comparison -> should work (red marker in GNT-T)

 4. Change left side to GNT-TR (no changes found of course)

 5. Change back to GNT-T -> Now different changes are displayed. (s. screenshot)

Attached File  comparison bug.png   55.99KB   0 downloads


Edited by Elijah, 13 September 2014 - 01:56 PM.


#12 דָנִיאֶל

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Posted 13 September 2014 - 01:32 PM

This is a different thing. It's keying the comparison off the search text. In the top tab you have search text of GNT-TR and in the lower one GNT-T. That causes the single text comparison to take different texts as the base text in each case.

 

thx
D


Sola lingua bona est lingua mortua

ἡ μόνη ἀγαθὴ γλῶσσα γλῶσσα νεκρὰ ἐστιν

lišanu ēdēnitu damqitu lišanu mītu

 

"Du stammst vom Herrn Adam und der Herrin Eva ab", sagte Aslan. "Und das ist zugleich Ehre genug, um das Häupt des ärmsten Bettlers zu erheben, und genug, um die Schultern des größten Kaisers auf Erden zu beugen. Sei zufrieden." Aslan, Die Chroniken von Narnia, Prinz Kaspian von Narnia. CS Lewis. Übersetzt von Wolfgang Holbein und Christian Rendel.

 

Accordance Configurations :
 
Mac : 2009 27" iMac                 Windows : MSI GE72 7RE Apache Pro laptop
      Intel Core Duo                          Intel i7 Kabylake
      12GB RAM                                16GB RAM
      Accordance 11.2.4 and 12                Accordance 12
      OSX 10.11 (Yosemite)                    Win 10 Home x64

 

 


#13 Elijah

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Posted 13 September 2014 - 01:40 PM

hm ok, so the text I'm using as search target is used as base for the comparison and never has any comparison highlighting?

I would prefer it if the red marker would display in GNT-T as this is the text I'm reading (like in my last screenshot when GNT-TR is the search text) - I might miss the marking in the GNT-TR.

 

Somehow I thought I had seen highlighting on both sides when comparing two texts in the past.

Has this always been that way?

 

Update: In Accordance 8 it was how I remembered it (see screenshot from the training video). Both sides have highlighting. 

Attached File  accordance 8.png   234.11KB   1 downloads

Update 2: I checked the settings. I had multiple texts enabled. After changing back to "Single text" both side have highlighting. 

Thats understandable because it would be difficult to integrate all the differences of multiple texts.

Thanks for bearing with me ...


Edited by Elijah, 13 September 2014 - 01:53 PM.


#14 Julia Falling

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Posted 13 September 2014 - 01:44 PM

Daniel –

 

The GNT-NA is a NA27th sans tagging.  When you hover all you get is an English transliteration.


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#15 דָנִיאֶל

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Posted 13 September 2014 - 01:51 PM

Daniel –

 

The GNT-NA is a NA27th sans tagging.  When you hover all you get is an English transliteration.

Ah ok - thx D.

 

hm ok, so the text I'm using as search target is used as base for the comparison and never has any comparison highlighting?

I would prefer it if the red marker would display in GNT-T as this is the text I'm reading (like in my last screenshot when GNT-TR is the search text) - I might miss the marking in the GNT-TR.

 

Somehow I thought I had seen highlighting on both sides when comparing two texts in the past.

Has this always been that way?

 

Update: In Accordance 8 it was how I remembered it (see screenshot from the training video). Both sides have highlighting. 

attachicon.gifaccordance 8.png

Was there any reasoning behind the decision?

Sorry Elijah I got this backward. What you are seeing is when Multitext compare is selected. In that case a single text is used as the reference to which a number of text may be compared. If you change to single text compare it will get you highlights in both panes.

This is select from the pulldown menu next to the compare check box.

 

Thx

D


Sola lingua bona est lingua mortua

ἡ μόνη ἀγαθὴ γλῶσσα γλῶσσα νεκρὰ ἐστιν

lišanu ēdēnitu damqitu lišanu mītu

 

"Du stammst vom Herrn Adam und der Herrin Eva ab", sagte Aslan. "Und das ist zugleich Ehre genug, um das Häupt des ärmsten Bettlers zu erheben, und genug, um die Schultern des größten Kaisers auf Erden zu beugen. Sei zufrieden." Aslan, Die Chroniken von Narnia, Prinz Kaspian von Narnia. CS Lewis. Übersetzt von Wolfgang Holbein und Christian Rendel.

 

Accordance Configurations :
 
Mac : 2009 27" iMac                 Windows : MSI GE72 7RE Apache Pro laptop
      Intel Core Duo                          Intel i7 Kabylake
      12GB RAM                                16GB RAM
      Accordance 11.2.4 and 12                Accordance 12
      OSX 10.11 (Yosemite)                    Win 10 Home x64

 

 





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