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A good review of Accordance v Logos


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#1 Paul Meiklejohn

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Posted 17 December 2014 - 02:21 AM

This is an excellent review and comparison of both Bible Software Programs.  Very fair and well-balanced. 

 

A good read for those who like to keep up-to-date.

 

http://rootedthinkin...gos-accordance/

 

Article by Dustin Battles.

 

 


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#2 rcdeacon

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Posted 17 December 2014 - 05:24 AM

An excellent an fair review! While I use BOTH programs Accordance is EASILY my hands down favorite. Its speed and stability (which increases productivity) are legendary and outweigh any perceived deficiency in the library and also the seriously lagging IOS app! And may I not forget the customer support which is "above and beyond" in my view! Thanks Dustin for putting it all in perspective!


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#3 Paul Daunno

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Posted 17 December 2014 - 08:07 AM

I thought it was a very good review and provided clear and concise pros and cons of each.

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#4 Martin Zhang

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Posted 17 December 2014 - 09:39 AM

It is a very good review.

Just want to add some of my own words.

 

I prefer Dropbox sync much better than server sync. I just feel that users more sense of control of their own resources.

When we sync user files to server, we never know what the company will do to those files. Of course this also applies to Dropbox. However, Dropbox at least has nothing to do with Accordance files. 

I just feel that users have more control of the resources with Accordance, at least the sense of ownership with user files.

 

When I am interested in some resources, I usually search them on websites such as amazon, logos and Accordance to compare the price. Sometimes I do not want to buy at all. I just want to "have a look" out of curiosity.

When I searched resources on Logos website, I got call from the sales department of Logos. I was asked if I was interested in the resources that I was searching. They were doing "great" jobs in selling. However, I did not like it. I don't want the feeling of being "monitored." Of course I do not have to log in to do searching. However, as a student, I must log in to see if I can get some discount on that resource.

And, I had a few times, when the salesman called me, saying that I might get some discount on certain resources. Then I asked what price I could get. It turned out that the price offered to me was exactly the same as the price I saw online. 

After a few calls, I did not want to receive any call from them anymore. But, how can I "unsubscribe" from their call list?

The best thing I can do is to try to avoid searching resources on Logos website if not necessary.

 

 

Dustin Battles thinks Logos is better on Mobile app. I agree that Logos it better on have android app. I use android phone. I wish Accordance has android app. 

However, I prefer Accordance iOS app much better than the Logos one. 

90%+ of time when I open the iOS app, it is for Bible reading. The most thing I do is to click the Hebrew/Greek word in the text to see the parsing and/or gloss. Accordance does great job. On Logos you have to click twice. And the fonts are ugly. And, you have to be online to see the parsing and gloss. I can only use it when I am connected to wifi. And due the internet speed, the supposed "instant details" is not instant at all. I commented this on app store long long ago, but never got any feedback from them, not did not make any improvement. Why do I use it while I have Accordance?

 

Overall, I feel Logos is pretty "aggressive" in controlling and selling resources. And it is too "aggressive"to me. 

 

What I am trying to say is: while Dustin Battles' review seems to imply that Accordance can do better marketing, I would say: do not be too aggressive.

I think Dustin Battles is right that if Accordance made the Windows version earlier, it would get a bigger market. If the Windows version came out before I came to seminary, I would have invested more money on Accordance. I can't think of for ministers, besides helping others, what is a better investment other than getting a good Bible research software with a good library and a good computer in order to run the software?

 

Of course, searching capability, speed and available resources are the most important factors when I consider using an app. Logos has advantage on only the third one. But again, as Dustin Battles points out, Accordance basically has the necessary resources we need (which is not the case of BW, unfortunately). And as Accordance is making more resources available, I feel it is the best app to be invested in.

I use Logos mainly as a reference library. I still use it, but mainly for resources I don't have on Accordance (due to either the price on Logos is cheaper or only Logos has the resource).

 

One problem with Accordance iOS app is that when a hebrew word has prefix or suffix (or maybe just the suffix?), I cannot easily search for the Hebrew word. Accordance tends to search for both lemmas. I have to go to the search bar to delete the suffix and run the search again. In cases such as עצבונך in Gen 3.16, when search for root shows the result for [SUFFIX] עצב+; when amplify for root result in "This entry was not found in any of the tools or texts requested."

 

 

I wish to make עצב+ (without prefix or suffix) as the default search entry. And, even better if we can have the options including with/without prefix and/or suffix.

 

Blessings,
Martin

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#5 davidmedina

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Posted 17 December 2014 - 01:09 PM

Interesting review but some misleading statements that makes me question if he really have used Logos for any amount of time or has learned how to use it. For example:

 

  • Logos allows you to save a “layout” inside the app itself.
  • Accordance lets you customize to your heart’s desire. Save your “workspace” files anywhere and open them next time exactly how they were.

They both can be customize to your heart content. The only difference is how you call where you store your preferences. 

 

I think the real difference between both apps is what their creator focused on. Accordance was geared more toward the scholar that knows his tools and know what he is looking for and don't want "software magic" to get in his or her way while Logos toward the Bible student, layman and pastor that need to handle large amount of data in an effective and quick manner.

 

I do enjoy immensely learning and using both. I appreciate what each brings to the plate. I have reviewed each software extensively from the layman point of view (and not in just one quick article but in a series of articles). And I use both at different times. But to be honest I use mostly Logos because it fits better to my style and offers me more of what I am looking for, like the Mobile ed platform which is just fabulous concept. Of course, scholarly types won't care much for it because they don't need it and it would be unneeded overhead for them. 

 

What is consider cluttered, simple and fast is in the eyes of the beholder based on user specific needs. 

 

Martin, yes Logos and Olive Tree are more aggressive in their marketing than Accordance. They are, after all, businesses. They want to make profit plus to develop software and resources costs lots of money. Ask the people at Accordance if available funds does not have direct effect on their priorities.  I do appreciate their reminders and calls. If  am not interested I just say, thanks but not thanks. But more often than not it has saved me money in resources I have been wanting to buy. After all that is why i search the website and I create wish lists. I would appreciate if I would get reminders from Accordance when a tool I have on my wish list has a discounted price or special offer. I would probably buy more from them than I do now. 


Edited by davidmedina, 17 December 2014 - 01:27 PM.

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#6 Abram K-J

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Posted 17 December 2014 - 01:19 PM

They both can be customize to your heart content. The only difference is how you call where you store your preferences.

 

I saw this review when Accordance linked to it on their Facebook yesterday. Good stuff, indeed.

 

One distinction he didn't mention along those lines is that Accordance allows you to have multiple Workspaces open and saved at once (a Session), whereas in Logos you can only have one Layout (their equivalent of a Workspace) open at a time. In that sense, Accordance is more customizable in that area. I have several 6-workspace sessions I use. (!)


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#7 davidmedina

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Posted 17 December 2014 - 01:30 PM

Abram, that is precisely what I mean. I dont think that is such a good review as he misses many important strength of both apps. To me is just another superficial review that just look at a list of feature instead of showing why one feature work best for some users and may not for others. He tried but I think is a miss.

 

When I was in the market I looked for in-depth reviews and found none that would actually spoke to my needs or were really helpful. Worst, most sounded like ads for their respective apps..  That is what's missing here too. He just compare features and nothing else.

 

But the fact remains that you can customize on both apps your "workspaces". The only difference is how they are called. What he says is misleading.


Edited by davidmedina, 17 December 2014 - 01:34 PM.

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#8 jeremyduncan

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Posted 17 December 2014 - 01:36 PM

Having used both I didn't find the statement misleading. It mirrors my experience. But I guess that's the thing with any review, it's always going to be subjective.

 

I like Logos and find their iOS app is much better (which is probably why I end up using it more than the actually Mac Logos app), but I have repeatedly asked them to stop emailing and phoning me and it never seems to stick. I find it far too invasive to make sure I log out of my account before searching their website unless I want a follow up contact. I hope that's one thing Accordance never picks up from Logos (though there are others I would like to see brought over ;) )


Edited by jeremyduncan, 17 December 2014 - 01:38 PM.


#9 Daniel Francis

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Posted 17 December 2014 - 02:42 PM

I too thought it seemed a fair and balanced review. Accordance and Logos are different sized companies with seemingly different goals (yet i have no doubt both trying to make software for the love of Christ). I have no doubt both companies do their best to offer resources (oftentimes i look at a Logos offering and say WHY (some offerings seem of limited appeal but then I am occasionally shocked to realize there was a demand for something)). Logos will likely always offer more resources, but Accordance tends to have most all the resources most will want. I and others could easily list dozens of ways each program is better than the other, I try to accept each one has it's strengths and weaknesses. I generally recommend Accordance for 2 simple reasons. It is far more inexpensive to get into, and it is more stable in my experience (indeed I have no idea what is going on in Logos world Windows side, but I see a number of long term experienced users complaining that the current stable release is so slow as to make them consider downgrading till things are fixed, I feel  a little Schadenfreude to have a well running mac app and hearing the Windows app is failing after years of less than stellar performance with the mac side of their program. That said I hope soon their windows app is functioning properly ASAP). I think Accordance values each of their customers, while Logos has stated more than once they are not overly interested in any customer who is not willing to make a $300 investment (due to costs with support). Faithlife staff have stated a willingness to create a custom packages available for large church groups (i believe the set goal was $100-$150). Recently it was pointed out a legacy package at Logos was an equally good  starter compared to the Accordance starter. I was delighted to know I could recommend a $50 package that could introduce people into Logos (it was mostly all public domain works and the addition of NASB Strongs/ Amplified and I think the Spanish version with strongs). IN under 2 weeks it was repriced to $299 before eventually being removed permanently from their site. I use both programs daily, I do spend more time in Logos because that is where the bulk of my Library is, but that said for the reasons I stated above I recommend people look at Accordance more often than I send them to Logos.

 

-Dan



#10 Rick Bennett

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Posted 17 December 2014 - 03:13 PM

 

I think the real difference between both apps is what their creator focused on. Accordance was geared more toward the scholar that knows his tools and know what he is looking for and don't want "software magic" to get in his or her way…

 

This may have been true from our app's inception, but it is not any longer. Specifically, Accordance 11 has added several new "magical" features that address this in a way that still makes sense inside the Accordance ecosystem that benefits both scholars and pastoral users alike. And, I might also add, that we have increased the number of pastoral and lay resources this year probably more than any other, and have many more on the way.

 

So, one thing that I am somewhat quick to correct when I hear it is that Accordance is only focused on scholars or original language resources, and not on building a library for pastors. We are focused on both, but on a different scale than others.


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#11 Daniel Francis

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Posted 17 December 2014 - 03:36 PM

Accordance 11 has added several new "magical" features that address this in a way that still makes sense inside the Accordance ecosystem that benefits both scholars and pastoral users alike. .

 

The info pane is such a blessing. Logos may have offered a passage guide first, but the InfoPane takes the idea one step forward and makes it far better. I am not always using it because I am use to my own study habits in Accordance but whenever I do use it I am so glad it is there and marvel at it's quickness.

 

-Dan


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#12 Rick Bennett

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Posted 17 December 2014 - 03:38 PM

David, I just saw your comments on Dustin's blog and thought I would comment on two items here:

 

Accordance is a app for what I call Analog Bible student. It works the same way you would with hard copy. It is for those who knows his resources and always use the same ones. Logos appeal more to the one looking for a research assistant.

 

 

Again, I think this is based off of your experience using earlier versions of Accordance. Have you used or seen any of the demos of Accordance 11? I'm not saying that v. 11 has addressed all that it could in this regard, but it is a big step forward.

 

I disagree with any statement that says that Logos runs “horribly slow”. That will only happens if you try to run any modern app in an old system. Just try to run Adobe Photoshop in a 2010 computer vs a 2014 one and you will, also conclude that Photoshop runs “horribly slow”. Not the app fault but the old computer.

 

 

 

This is not true. I know of many "modern" apps that will run perfectly fine on a 2010 MacBook Pro or a 2014 MacBook Pro (ask Abram, he has a 2008 MBP and iMac). And case in point, Accordance 11 will run perfect on an even older Mac than 2010. If an app developer should ever tell you (within reason) that you need to upgrade to a new machine in order to use it without issues, that's wrong in my opinion.


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#13 Abram K-J

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Posted 17 December 2014 - 03:51 PM

Haha... I was reading Rick's post and was just about to say, "Yeah! I have two 2008 machines that run Accordance quite well!" and then kept reading and saw my name. :) I concur with Rick's point.


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#14 Martin Zhang

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Posted 17 December 2014 - 04:33 PM

Martin, yes Logos and Olive Tree are more aggressive in their marketing than Accordance. They are, after all, businesses. They want to make profit plus to develop software and resources costs lots of money. Ask the people at Accordance if available funds does not have direct effect on their priorities.  I do appreciate their reminders and calls. If  am not interested I just say, thanks but not thanks. But more often than not it has saved me money in resources I have been wanting to buy. After all that is why i search the website and I create wish lists. I would appreciate if I would get reminders from Accordance when a tool I have on my wish list has a discounted price or special offer. I would probably buy more from them than I do now. 

 

Hi David, thank you for your words. I understand that companies need to make money to pay staff and to make a better software. That's something I am concerned about: after all, who pays for the marketing staff? If take it as business, customer service should be more important than the marketing, according to my opinion, especially that most customers are or will be ministers. What I meant was, they would probably spend money more carefully than average people. I personally instinctually resist too much marketing. I know that I'm gonna pay the money used for marketing if I buy their product.

 

My impression before was that Accordance resources are the most expensive compare with Logos and BW.

BW is the cheapest. If BW has more resources, I would recommend most students from developing countries to buy BW. But now I recommend only those who can afford $250 and do not have money or do not want to spend more money on electronic resources. 

Recently I saw Accordance has more sales. When the resources are on sale, or when we have a group shopping. Many times they are cheaper than those of Logos.

 

Concerning the calls, I think it is not necessarily a bad thing. Since they are doing this, I believe that they can offer a better price. But I do wish that they check the price already available to me first, and make sure they can offer a better deal before they dial my phone number. It's better if they can just send me an email with a price for my reference. Then I may decide whether to buy or not. Sometimes I might be in the library. I come across a resource, and want to check out the price. Then receiving a call, I have to go out to answer the phone. After I know that it is from Logos company, I was hoping that they could really offer a good price. Then was disappointed that the price they could offer is as the same as I saw (I would say, most of the time, it was because I already had the student discount. That's why I wish they new whom they are calling.)

 

Having that that, I think I need to say that I'm not familiar with all the three softwares I mentioned. Some comments might not reflect the facts.

For Accordance, I actually just started to spend more time to explore Accordance since two months ago. And I was amazed at how powerful it is.

 

Before Accordance released the Windows version, I argued with my cousin, who had Accordance, that BW is the most affordable software for developing country students, most of whom have only Windows computer and can hardly afford an expensive Bible software. But I have changed my mind. I think Accordance is perhaps a better choice if students can raise more fund, or the best if Accordance can make the price even more affordable for them.

 

While I still recommend BW and Logos, I recommend Accordance with enthusiasm.


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#15 Michel Gilbert

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Posted 17 December 2014 - 04:56 PM

 

 

I prefer Accordance iOS app much better than the Logos one. 

90%+ of time when I open the iOS app, it is for Bible reading. The most thing I do is to click the Hebrew/Greek word in the text to see the parsing and/or gloss. Accordance does great job. On Logos you have to click twice. And the fonts are ugly. And, you have to be online to see the parsing and gloss. I can only use it when I am connected to wifi. And due the internet speed, the supposed "instant details" is not instant at all. I commented this on app store long long ago, but never got any feedback from them, not did not make any improvement. Why do I use it while I have Accordance?

 

 

Hi Martin,

 

I agree wholeheartedly.

 

To those who don't know, the order in Logos is:

 

1st tap - a menu pops up with Copy / Look Up  / Search / Share  /  Highlight  /  Note  / Edit Note

 

2nd tap - tap Look Up , which gives a gloss and parsing

 

3rd tap - tap Bible Word Study

 

           - if you press Bible Word Study before the gloss and parsing appear,

             you won't be directed to a lexicon; you must wait

 

4th tap - tap on your preferred lexicon

 

Then, to return to your text, you tap on a blank space, and press the go back arrow two times.

 

 

In Accordance, you tap and hold, and get all of the above, with your preferred lexicon.

 

This single tap feature, which enables rapid reading, was the reason I bought an iPad vs. an Android device with remote desktop software. I did consider BW on a Windows 8 tablet - it too requires only a single tap. But since I already owned Accordance, it was more economical to get the iPad than a Windows 8 Tablet and BW.

 

Regards,

 

Michel


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#16 William B

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Posted 17 December 2014 - 05:22 PM

This may have been true from our app's inception, but it is not any longer. Specifically, Accordance 11 has added several new "magical" features that address this in a way that still makes sense inside the Accordance ecosystem that benefits both scholars and pastoral users alike. And, I might also add, that we have increased the number of pastoral and lay resources this year probably more than any other, and have many more on the way.
 
So, one thing that I am somewhat quick to correct when I hear it is that Accordance is only focused on scholars or original language resources, and not on building a library for pastors. We are focused on both, but on a different scale than others.

Great news that more are on the way. I have no regrets over choosing accordance as my software. As a (new!!) pastor the resources are great, I use the iOS app almost exclusively (switching on a windows computer alone is a frustrating experience!). My only frustration is waiting for v2 of the iOS app :)
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#17 rpavich

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Posted 04 January 2015 - 05:25 AM

How about a comment from a layman?

I'm not a pastor or teacher of any kind, I'm just a Bible student and A long term logos user.

Out of curiosity I tried the Accordance demo and immediately purchased it.

I switched to accordance for the reasons stated above, Logos was just too sluggish overall, and not quite intuitive enough for me. It just never lost that bloated feeling.

Accordance is snappy, responsive, easy to use, and an overall better user experience in my opinion.

Hopefully Accordance won't lose site of what got them to the party.

PS: I prefer Accordances iOS app

Edited by rpavich, 04 January 2015 - 05:26 AM.

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#18 Natan Rubenstein

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Posted 04 January 2015 - 09:37 AM

As someone who is new to both Accordance and Logos (mainly for review purposes), I think both applications are far from worthy in the academic market. While they may sustain the first ten to twenty minutes of research, neither application can sustain prolonged research in my opinion. By prolonged research, I mean when I look at a Dead Sea Scroll or Qumran fragment, Accordance is usable for only one type of question: concordance related issues and/or indexing. Logos goes one step further by at least mirroring the lines of the fragment in their reconstructions (much like as presented in the DJD editions). Logos can handle the categorization of the data much better too, as they have not opted to adhere to anachronistic categories in the presentation of the scrolls (e.g., look at 11Q5 in Accordance as compared to Logos). Scholars are well aware of the fluid aspect of the text in the Second Temple era—and modern categories are deleterious to understanding Judaism of the Second Temple era. Thus, these tools are beneficial to a very limited degree. Like I said, they can sustain research for a moment, but you will eventually find yourself in need of print editions.

 

I am somewhat baffled too by examining Accordance's claims to be superior at the academic level. When I first was told of Accordance's textual emphasis, I expected to find a high quality and extensive coverage of manuscripts. Not only are texts presented poorly in my view, but there is a lacuna of texts are missing from Accordance—particularly LXX related studies. I will say, after having review the New Testament manuscripts, the scholar responsible for those has done a much better job. But why not the Septuagint portions of these same Manuscripts?! Such a piecemeal approach destroys the evidence to a degree! Oh vey!

 

Both applications are good for the self-motivated lay person. Both are good to get some initial questions answered, with Logos having the edge at the text level. Sorry. I don't read ebooks, so I am interested in only texts, grammars, and manuscript images (which I recently learned that Logos has a separate index directory to link all their DSS and Qumran transcriptions to the Leon Levy Website, kudos! to them!). For the serious textual academic, both Accordance and Logos are weak. You would be better off to use the Dead Sea Scrolls Electronic Library, as it is higher quality and actually has manuscript images to accompany the transcriptions).

 

So hearing from Rick Bennett above that Accordance is a lay persons tool is somewhat comforting.



#19 Enoch

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Posted 04 January 2015 - 10:02 AM

I would have backquoted here, but the quote function on this forum has not been working here for me.  I get a little green box that pops up in top center of screen when I try to quote.

 

I have an Hispanic pastor who just got both Accordance & Logos.  Accordance is very lean on Spanish resources.  Logos has a large supply of resources and various grade level packages for Spanish Logos, commentaries, etc.  Apparently in general, Logos has much more available by way of electronic books than does Accordance, even in ancient Greek.  I think Logos also has a more up to date LSJ than Accordance.

 

When the pastor's Accordance was downloaded, the download was fast and efficient.  Logos was glacier slow.  When I invested in Logos myself (to get the ancient Greek library, I think my computer ran Mountain Lion.  It took something like 24 hours to download.  In the case of this pastor, it was into the 3rd day in downloading his Spanish Tesoro level (+ whatever else was purchased).  I thought he was better off to have his Greek & Hebrew Bible resources in Accordance; but there was nothing like Logos in Accordance for Spanish resources.

 

I was helping this pastor download Logos.  It seemed to just sit there with no progress; percent loaded static.  I looked at Activity Monitor & it was downloading very slowly.  You go away & come back in an hour, & the basic download screen shows no progress!  On the 3rd day only 40 percent showed downloaded.  I phoned Logos, and it was suggested that the problem was Yosemite & WiFi, but we were using ethernet cable.  Logos directed me to contact Apple, which went nowhere, as I thought.  Logos claims it is Yosemite's fault; but if so, there is no explanation why Accordance loads so efficiently with Yosemite.  Their help pages at their site gives a Terminal string to paste in Terminal! (I think its purpose is to stop the download).   I stopped the downloading, force quitting all I could.  I ran the Terminal string.  (Computer did not explode!)  I turned on Logos off line & it worked on itself until something appeared when I clicked the icon.  Some resources were now present.  I resumed the download, still slow.  I stopped & started the download twice.  Finally it downloaded.

 

I have gotten better support from Accordance than Logos, though Logos is polite and never has insulted me.  

 

Then I downloaded the free book of the Month, a commentary on Genesis.  Logos gives away a book of the month (or even a set of books for the month).  

 

Incidentally, when I tried to download into a 2007 computer I found out that Accordance goes very well into the older Snow Leopard machine.  But Logos 6 requires Mavericks or Yosemite.  I learned.  So I was blocked by Logos.  Then I spent 2 hours on the phone with Apple trying to download Mavericks.  I myself found out by searching internet that the 2007 MacBook was not able to swallow Mavericks.  So a newer Mac was required to use Logos 6.

 

Both programs to me seem hard to learn, not immediately intuitive, requiring a lot of time learning.  My initial impression is that Logos is less intuitive than Accordance, harder to learn how to use.


Edited by Enoch, 04 January 2015 - 10:27 AM.


#20 Natan Rubenstein

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Posted 04 January 2015 - 11:14 AM

One more thing to add, at least for the programmers to think about. Accordance crashes on me at least once every time I use it. In comparison, Logos has crashed only once since I've used it. For a company whose primary platform is Mac, I am somewhat puzzled that there are so many bugs in the program. Another very annoying bug, which I suspect relates to your underlying code architecture, is that Accordance is poor at managing window position with dual monitors. At my office, I use an external monitor. When I open Accordance it appears on the far side of the screen (Why? other Apple apps do just fine readjusting!). Logos has the same problem, however. 






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