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Need help understanding Hebrew Syntax


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#1 joelmadasu

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Posted 28 December 2014 - 01:14 PM

What is the "-1" in the picture below? What does it really indicate?

 

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Joel

#2 Darin Franklin

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Posted 28 December 2014 - 06:08 PM

The is a "null identifier" and the 1 means "antecedent".  These are mentioned briefly in the help file, under The Syntax Pane.

  • Null items (words understood but not found in the text) are indicated with a dash (-), and antecedents are indicated by numerals such as 01.

I found a little more info in Getting Started With Syntax, which is on the Accordance Exchange.

 

2. Nulls — To preserve the regular syntax structure of a text, null identifiers may be added to show where an understood subject, predicate, or complement would be placed within the clause.

3. Antecedents — To assist in showing syntactical relationships, antecedent identifier labels are sometimes added to show relationships between a word and its antecedent. A null identifier may also be combined with an antecedent identifier.

...

Null
1-9
Antecedent identifier
01-09 Null antecedent identifier

 

If you search for "‏ ‎[ANTECEDENT]‏ ‎<AND>‏ ‎[RANGE Gen 39.5]‏", you will see four flag markers that correspond to the four 1's in your example. If you search for "[NULL] <AND> [RANGE Gen 39.5]", you will find six pin markers that correspond to the dashes.



#3 joelmadasu

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Posted 28 December 2014 - 10:18 PM

Thank you for your help!


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Joel

#4 joelmadasu

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Posted 07 January 2015 - 10:51 AM

So the numerals like "-1" indicates the position of the antecedents?


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Joel

#5 joelmadasu

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Posted 10 January 2015 - 11:44 AM

I read some manuals on syntax, but I am still missing something. What are these numerals for? (-1, -2, -3 etc). I don't think the manuals said much about these numerals. So if someone can help me understand this, I will really appreciate! :)


Thank you
Joel

#6 דָנִיאֶל

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Posted 10 January 2015 - 02:40 PM

Hey Joel,

 

  They identify a specific antecedent, in this case number 1. I don't have the Hebrew syntax but I believe the theory is the same. Here's an example from Greek.

Attached File  antecedent.jpg   37.37KB   0 downloads

 

  Here you see a 2 referring back to Mary and a 1 indicating in a case where the antecedent is present but the point where it is referred to is the substantive participle.

  I am wondering if you have shown enough of the syntax in your image. Is there a bit more going back where it will show the 1 rather than just -1 on empty leaves of the syntax tree ?

Thx

D


Edited by Daniel Semler, 10 January 2015 - 02:43 PM.

Sola lingua bona est lingua mortua
ἡ μόνη ἀγαθὴ γλῶσσα γλῶσσα νεκρὰ ἐστιν
lišanu ēdēnitu damqitu lišanu mītu

"Du stammst vom Herrn Adam und der Herrin Eva ab", sagte Aslan. "Und das ist zugleich Ehre genug, um das Häupt des ärmsten Bettlers zu erheben, und genug, um die Schultern des größten Kaisers auf Erden zu beugen. Sei zufrieden." Aslan, Die Chroniken von Narnia, Prinz Kaspian von Narnia. CS Lewis. Übersetzt von Wolfgang Holbein und Christian Rendel.

Accordance Syntax Search For Wallace's Greek Grammar Beyond the Basics : https://github.com/4...WallaceInSyntax

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#7 Robert Holmstedt

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Posted 10 January 2015 - 05:56 PM

Darin and Daniel are correct. The numerals indicate where an anaphor (explicit or null) is indicated and the numeral allows you to identify its antecedent in the clause. The use of 1-9 reflects that fact that some clauses become very complex, with multiple different antecedents each with their own anaphors. 

 

The two cases where we use this system of cross-referencing (aka coindexation) is with:

1) relative clauses, e.g., the man1 that I kicked him1

and

2) left and right dislocation (aka casus pendens), e.g., that man1 — I kicked him1.


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#8 joelmadasu

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 10:56 AM

Thank you Dr. Holmstedt, Darin and Daniel!

I think I am getting it now :)

I have posted another picture here. Please tell me if I am "really" getting it haha.

 

 

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Thank you
Joel

#9 דָנִיאֶל

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 11:24 AM

This is how I would read it, so if you're not getting it neither am I.

Hopefully Dr. Holmstedt can confirm.

 

Thx

D


Sola lingua bona est lingua mortua
ἡ μόνη ἀγαθὴ γλῶσσα γλῶσσα νεκρὰ ἐστιν
lišanu ēdēnitu damqitu lišanu mītu

"Du stammst vom Herrn Adam und der Herrin Eva ab", sagte Aslan. "Und das ist zugleich Ehre genug, um das Häupt des ärmsten Bettlers zu erheben, und genug, um die Schultern des größten Kaisers auf Erden zu beugen. Sei zufrieden." Aslan, Die Chroniken von Narnia, Prinz Kaspian von Narnia. CS Lewis. Übersetzt von Wolfgang Holbein und Christian Rendel.

Accordance Syntax Search For Wallace's Greek Grammar Beyond the Basics : https://github.com/4...WallaceInSyntax

Accordance Configurations :

Mac : 2009 27" iMac
12GB RAM

Windows : MSI GE72 7RE Apache Pro laptop
Intel Core Duo Intel i7 Kabylake

Android : Samsung Note III 5.0, Samsung Tab S3 7.0 and Lenovo TAB4 8" 7.1

#10 Robert Holmstedt

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 09:51 PM

That is correct, although you happened to choose the third type of cross-referencing in the database, which I didn't describe above -- for ellipsis, a.k.a. gapping. That example shows two clauses joined under an umbrella clapse so that we could indicate by the antecedents which items were assumed (by ellipsis) in the second clause (in that case both מה and יש).
Professor, Hebrew and Northwest Semitic Languages
Dept. of Near and Middle Eastern Civilizations
The University of Toronto
blog: ancienthebrewgrammar.wordpress.com
https://utoronto.aca...RobertHolmstedt

#11 joelmadasu

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 10:38 PM

Thank you Dr. Holmstedt! It makes sense now :)


Thank you
Joel




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