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Intermediate Syntax resources?


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#1 Drew_A

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Posted 29 September 2016 - 12:31 PM

Hello All,

 

Just starting intermediate (2nd year) Greek. While we are focused mainly on readings, we are using Wallace's syntax. While an excellent comprehensive text, it is really hard to wrap my head around all the vast categories.  Actually it's becoming quite discouraging. Perhaps others have felt this way?

 

In any case, does any one have any good additional resources to learn these syntax concepts?  I really would love a video class of some sort (as we aren't really discussing the text during class.) Or as a possibility someone who does tutoring? Good modules I've missed that could show syntactical category options? (I have the syntax module for GNT)

 

Much appreciate any help/guidance!

Drew

 

 

 

 



#2 Helen Brown

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Posted 29 September 2016 - 02:45 PM

William Mounce has excellent resources available in Accordance, and a website with lots of video tutorials. Also see biblicaltraining.org, a free Accordance module with links to the website.


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#3 Drew_A

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Posted 29 September 2016 - 07:43 PM

Thanks Helen. Yes I used Mounce's materials for first year. Excellent on all fronts. I was hoping to find something for intermediate using the same methodology.



#4 Abram K-J

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Posted 29 September 2016 - 09:50 PM

Drew, have you tried Max Zerwick's Biblical Greek? That could be a helpful companion.

 

Also, you didn't ask about morphology, but if the reading portion of your class ever requires you to have your inflections down, Mounce's Morphology of Biblical Greek is a great resource (and available in Accordance).

 

What is it that's discouraging--the number of concepts and terminology, or some of the categories/concepts themselves?


Edited by Abram K-J, 29 September 2016 - 09:50 PM.

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#5 דָנִיאֶל

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Posted 29 September 2016 - 09:59 PM

I find Wallace's book is best dipped into, reading a chapter or a chunk on the question at hand and then going back to reading Greek. Reading it cover to cover would probably hurt. It would be instructive but unless you can retain a good deal of information until you spot examples in the wild, it will seem very hard. What reader are you using ? I am currently going through Decker, Koine Greek Reader - its great and goes beyond the NT which useful. For a potted pithy post-first year grammar you might try something like David Allan Black's It's Still Greek to Me. You might also find Rodney Whitacre's Using and Enjoying Biblical Greek worth a look.

 

A reading group might be fun for a change if you can find one where people actually meet and read together. There are some online ones. I did one for a while and would again if time permitted. Having fun with language is a sure way to help with discouragement.

 

Thx

D


Sola lingua bona est lingua mortua
ἡ μόνη ἀγαθὴ γλῶσσα γλῶσσα νεκρὰ ἐστιν
lišanu ēdēnitu damqitu lišanu mītu

"Du stammst vom Herrn Adam und der Herrin Eva ab", sagte Aslan. "Und das ist zugleich Ehre genug, um das Häupt des ärmsten Bettlers zu erheben, und genug, um die Schultern des größten Kaisers auf Erden zu beugen. Sei zufrieden." Aslan, Die Chroniken von Narnia, Prinz Kaspian von Narnia. CS Lewis. Übersetzt von Wolfgang Holbein und Christian Rendel.

Accordance Syntax Search For Wallace's Greek Grammar Beyond the Basics : https://github.com/4...WallaceInSyntax

 

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#6 Drew_A

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Posted 30 September 2016 - 12:36 PM

Thanks so much for the suggestions Gents!

 

"What is it that's discouraging?" - I think it's more the amount of categories and remembering the names/uses etc... For example: going a simple use of the genitive as the case of 'possession' (key word is 'of') to possibly 27 different uses really threw me.

 

Morphology is really making sense to me. I love that Mounce book so very much. It has been essential for me to move forward.

 

I like the idea of an online group. I'll see if I can track down one.

 

 

 

BTW D: ἡ μόνη ἀγαθὴ γλῶσσα γλῶσσα νεκρὰ ἐστιν - ha! (i love that I can read this - and it made my day)


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#7 Abram K-J

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Posted 30 September 2016 - 02:10 PM

Drew, I wonder if you might also enjoy using the Baylor Handbooks on the Greek Text... they vary from volume to volume, but they show the naming of grammatical categories in action, within the context of a specific biblical book. That might make it easier to keep everything straight, or at least situate it within a biblical book so that you're not just rote memorizing categories. (Which itself has more value than folks admit, I think, but a reading context is most helpful, in my view.)
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#8 rwrobinson88

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Posted 01 October 2016 - 05:27 AM

There have been two new Intermediate Greek textbooks that have come out this year and both of them push against having so many genitive categories and such. It's hard though when you are taking a class and they have Wallace and you're expected to learn all of his categories. 

 

It might be worth asking the professor if they've heard about Kostenberger/Plumber/Merkle or Matthewson/Ewig? :) They are more up to date, especially from a linguistic perspective. Never know. You could help the next student! 



#9 Abram K-J

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Posted 01 October 2016 - 07:17 AM

There's also a laminated summary sheet for Wallace's intermediate grammar--something like $6 or $7 (published by Zondervan).


There have been two new Intermediate Greek textbooks that have come out this year and both of them push against having so many genitive categories and such. It's hard though when you are taking a class and they have Wallace and you're expected to learn all of his categories. 

 

Especially for reading the GNT continuously... maybe I should, but I don't know if I ever stop to ask what kind of genitive I'm looking at. 


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#10 דָנִיאֶל

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Posted 01 October 2016 - 11:22 AM

 


 

Especially for reading the GNT continuously... maybe I should, but I don't know if I ever stop to ask what kind of genitive I'm looking at. 

 

I don't think you should if you are understanding the text.

 

The way I look at it is this : the name is a post-facto assignment of a label to a phenomenon found in the wild of language. If the primary intention is to read the language and understand what is being conveyed, then knowing how to read a construction is more important than knowing its name. When I read my native language I don't think what each construction is called as I read and then decode what it means. While I have to do this to a greater or lesser extent with other languages it's not where I want to end up. I just want to read and understand. That isn't to say that such detailed dissection of categories isn't on occasion useful but I prefer to study it when I need to to comprehend a text rather than the other way around.

 

Thx

D


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Sola lingua bona est lingua mortua
ἡ μόνη ἀγαθὴ γλῶσσα γλῶσσα νεκρὰ ἐστιν
lišanu ēdēnitu damqitu lišanu mītu

"Du stammst vom Herrn Adam und der Herrin Eva ab", sagte Aslan. "Und das ist zugleich Ehre genug, um das Häupt des ärmsten Bettlers zu erheben, und genug, um die Schultern des größten Kaisers auf Erden zu beugen. Sei zufrieden." Aslan, Die Chroniken von Narnia, Prinz Kaspian von Narnia. CS Lewis. Übersetzt von Wolfgang Holbein und Christian Rendel.

Accordance Syntax Search For Wallace's Greek Grammar Beyond the Basics : https://github.com/4...WallaceInSyntax

 

Accordance Crib Sheets: http://47rooks.com/l...ch-crib-sheets/

 

 

Accordance Configurations :

Mac : 2009 27" iMac
12GB RAM

Windows : MSI GE72 7RE Apache Pro laptop
Intel Core Duo Intel i7 Kabylake

Android : Samsung Note III 5.0, Samsung Tab S3 7.0 and Lenovo TAB4 8" 7.1


#11 rwrobinson88

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Posted 01 October 2016 - 12:42 PM

Oh, the new grammars don't encourage not asking that question, they just have less labels. Just pulled Kostenberger/Merkle/Plummer off the shelf. They have 16 to Wallace's 27. If I'm remembering what I read correctly, they just thought that 27 was a little much. :) 



#12 Drew_A

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Posted 04 October 2016 - 12:51 PM

Thanks all for this helpful discussion and suggestions again.

 

Looking into those Baylor commentaries. They look great Abram! I think for me - it is hard to distinguish the nuances. For example, βασιλεὺς εἶ τοῦ Ἰσραήλ. - is Israel source? Possessor? etc.. I very much understand why this is so important for exegesis but challenging to wrap my engineering brain around :)

 

I have the Kos/Merkle/Plummer. It is a very helpful supplement to Wallace yet still hard at this stage to apply categories. Hopefully sometime soon I will be able to ask the right questions.

 

Being that I only really started in June, I do have to remember - this is all quite new.

Drew 



#13 Abram K-J

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Posted 04 October 2016 - 04:59 PM

I'm impressed if you just started Greek in June and you're already up to Wallace's grammar!


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#14 Daniel R

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Posted 05 October 2016 - 12:49 PM

Runge's book on Discourse Grammar is the most up-to-date.

 

https://www.amazon.c...t/dp/1598565834



#15 R. Mansfield

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Posted 21 January 2019 - 03:38 PM

Rod Decker's Koine Greek Reader is mentioned earlier in this thread. It is now available for Accordance!


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