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Zondervan Withdraws WBC v. 44


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#21 Fabian

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Posted 08 November 2016 - 07:32 AM

Well this is really my point. If there was an open online collaboration of ideas that were peer reviewed, then this online resource would be superior to all 90 of them. (Assuming the material was contributed and distributed without restriction) 

 

This is available its called Wikipedia. But its not approved by the Universities and Seminaries. But if you look which sources Wiki quotes then often its the same as the not kostenlosen Tools for Accordance.

 

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#22 Daniel Francis

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Posted 08 November 2016 - 10:50 AM

The word study dictionary particularly the OT one did heavily borrow from Moody's theological wordbook of the Old Testament but Moody made a deal allowing the dictionary to remake n n print as long as future editions acknowledged TWOT was one of the sources. Had his been a more academic work and not aimed at laypersons different actions may well have been taken. But for me this is the answer your correct the issue not destroy a worry for its flaws.

Dan

Edited by Dan Francis, 08 November 2016 - 10:51 AM.


#23 Daniel Francis

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Posted 08 November 2016 - 10:58 AM


#15 Spiros Zodhiates/Baker Complete Word Study Dictionary: post #15 R. Mansfield
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Posted 02 November 2012 - 08:12 AM
Well, you kind of have half of it now already in Accordance.

Back in the 90s, AMG paid a hefty sum to Moody Publishers after it was discovered that Zodhiates had plagiarized much of his Hebrew work from The Theological Word Book of the Old Testament. Moody didn't make AMG withdraw the titles that had used the cribbed content (which I believe included both the Key Study Bible and the Complete Word Study Dictionary), but they did have to pay a royalty, and they also had to begin including Moody copyright notices in addition to their own.

At the time I was working in a Baptist Book Store (now Lifeway) and editions of these works that were already printed began arriving with an insert regarding the additional copyright information.

Obviously, Zodiates is more well known for his Greek than his Hebrew expertise. His excuse when the plagiarized sections came to light was something along the lines that he didn't have time to research the Hebrew content, and it was just easier to "borrow" it from other sources. Obviously, he's not the first to do so, and he won't be the last.

Anyway, like I said, since The Theological Wordbook of the Old Testament is available in Accordance, you kind of have half of Zodhiates' work now :-)
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#24 Alistair

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Posted 08 November 2016 - 12:14 PM

Mercy triumphs over judgment.


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#25 Ιακοβ

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Posted 11 November 2016 - 12:37 AM

This is available its called Wikipedia. But its not approved by the Universities and Seminaries. But if you look which sources Wiki quotes then often its the same as the not kostenlosen Tools for Accordance.

 

Wikipedia doesn't even come close to having a small fraction of the information available in a useful commentary, nor does it provide an easy way to make that information available in one of the various layouts/structures chosen by the various commentaries.



#26 Alistair

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Posted 11 November 2016 - 08:20 AM

Wikipedia doesn't even come close to having a small fraction of the information available in a useful commentary, nor does it provide an easy way to make that information available in one of the various layouts/structures chosen by the various commentaries.

I wouldn't "trust" wikipedia for anything that I couldn't also verify from another source, preferably a printed/published work that contains full bibliographies etc.



#27 dcnorman

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Posted Yesterday, 11:13 PM

I'd like the story on WORD Commentary volumes that are being withdrawn or replaced.  If I purchase a print book, it is mine to keep, regardless of whether or not the author followed standard scholarly practices or even if the work is full of heresy or lies.  If a new commentary is published for a given book, I am not required to throw away the older print edition.  I approve of sending a notice informing folks of the reason for the update, but how is this practice different from censorship?  Doesn't NICNT let the customer keep the old version when a new one comes out?

 

As a secondary issue, if a volume is removed, shouldn't the customer receive a refund for the original purchase price of the volume removed?



#28 Daniel Francis

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Posted Today, 12:35 AM

Customers I believe were offered a refund those of us who wished to keep the volume were allowed to keep it. No computer software I know of removed the files from anyone just their stores. Same way all book stores had to return unsold copies for destruction.

-dan
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#29 ukfraser

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Posted Today, 03:58 AM

I'd like the story on WORD Commentary volumes that are being withdrawn or replaced. If I purchase a print book, it is mine to keep?

I can confirm that i still have volume 44 because i purchased it before it was withdrawn so although it is no longer available to buy, those who had it still retain it.

I can confirm i still have the original volume on psalms as well as the revised volume purchased later.

So Accordance works largely the same way as if you own a Print copy, buy it and you have it, even if publisher withdraws it or replaces it.

Upgrades to revised editions are on a case by case basis, sometimes you get an upgrade price if you own the original, sometimes you have to pay full (as with print copies), sometimes its free.

I could not have afforded the wbc in print and was unable to find a wbc cd at a price i could afford so have been mega happy with the accordance deals which have enabled me to own this excellent set which has grown as new volumes have been published.

WBC history (like other sets-that have evolved) is quite complex.

The history is well documented here so you can see what was available depending on which set you bought. I am fortunate that i bought in fairly early so have most volumes.
https://www.accordan....php#SetHistory

Edited by ukfraser, Today, 04:16 AM.

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#30 Alistair

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Posted Today, 11:30 AM

Customers I believe were offered a refund those of us who wished to keep the volume were allowed to keep it. No computer software I know of removed the files from anyone just their stores. Same way all book stores had to return unsold copies for destruction.

-dan

Oak Tree has never offered me a refund on any withdrawn volumes. 



#31 jarcher

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Posted Today, 11:36 AM

Oak Tree has never offered me a refund on any withdrawn volumes. 

 

Well.. do you still have the book in your library? :-)



#32 Alistair

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Posted Today, 02:38 PM

Well.. do you still have the book in your library? :-)

Yes. They just never offered me the option to return it for a refund.


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#33 Daniel Francis

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Posted Today, 03:05 PM

I did not remember the exact offers from either Accordance or Logos... I had thought a refund had been offered on one of the removed books but it may have been the EEC volume in FL since that is a FL product and they had more say over what was offered. I had no desire to return any volume so paid little attention beyond a desire to ensure that the volume remained in my library.

 

-dan


Edited by Daniel Francis, Today, 03:06 PM.


#34 keithp

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Posted Today, 03:19 PM

I think it is worth holding on to, the whole thing against O'Brien seemed a little over the top...granted he could and should have been more careful, but it is still a valuable resource to read and have IMO


Shalom! In Christ, Keith. Check out my music www.soundcloud.com/kpang808 

 

#35 dcnorman

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Posted Today, 04:28 PM

The current upgrade description doesn't sound like you can keep certain older versions.  The word replace is used to describe what will happen for Joshua, Psalms 1-50 and 2Corinthians and remove for Colossians/Philemon, if you get the current upgrade.

 

https://www.accordan...Set-58Judges-up



#36 ukfraser

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Posted Today, 05:38 PM

Dont confuse the wbc set (where the volumes have been replaced and removed as described in the product description),
and the content listed under my products which lists the volumes you have bought ( the volumes will still be available in your library, just no longer in the set for new purchasers).

Look at the history
https://www.accordan....php#SetHistory

Edited by ukfraser, Today, 05:46 PM.

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#37 Julie Palmer

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Posted Today, 06:04 PM

With all of the Accordance upgrades/set modifications, users never lose any product they previously purchased. And in most cases, we have been able to provide no-longer-available volumes as individual downloads to make it more convenient for the users to upgrade to the latest sets while retaining those volumes and not have to keep both full sets in their library.

 

So in the case of the aforementioned upgrade from the 58-volume set to the 61-volume set, the user wouldn't lose any of the 58-volume product (WBC-OT + WBC-NT) if they upgraded to the 61-volume product (WBC-OT-36 + WBC-NT-25). The upgrade notes are simply stating what the differences are between the initial product and the upgrade product.

 

An example from that upgrade as to the "replacements": The initial 1-volume Joshua (in the 58-volume product) was revised and replaced by a 2-volume version (in the 61-volume product). The 1-volume Joshua was added as an individual download to the WBC-OT product so that any user who upgraded to the 61-volume product could remove the full WBC-OT from their library and still have the initial Joshua volume (as a separate module) in addition to the new WBC-OT-36 module.

 

In the rare cases that we have not been able to provide the individual volumes as separate downloads, the user would still never lose any products they purchased.


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