Christopher A Hall volumes currently on sale

[ukfraser]

Hi, in the current sale, there are three volumes on the church fathers by this author. He has contributed to the spiritual formation bible so i am familiar with some of his work.

 

Unfortunately, neither have been reviewed by any on this forum. I know i have too many books already which i am slowly reading but as they are on offer, would anyone who has them care to offer a quick review on how useful they have found them to be?

 

I have downloaded a couple of kindle samples and amazon reviews seem favourable. they seem very readable so am tempted but also quite short so wonder if they raise more questions than they answer.

 

https://www.accordancebible.com/store/details/?pid=Fathers-Theology

https://www.accordancebible.com/store/details/?pid=Fathers-Worship

https://www.accordancebible.com/store/details/?pid=Fathers-Scripture

Thanks

 

Ps, if someone wants to sort out the typo in this thread title, id be more than happy.

Pps, i hadnt realised accordance had all three volumes, you may want to look at the descriptions and add links, particularly in the worshipping volume which doesnt link to reading the scriptures.

;o(

Edited June 13, 2017 by ukfraser

[R. Mansfield]

I've read Reading Scripture with the Church Fathers and thought it was so good that I've given away two print copies so far to folks who wanted to know more about the Church Fathers (this book is a really good starting point). If I remember correctly, Reading Scripture came out about the same time as the first volume in the ACCS and is from that same "paleo-Orthodox" group of writers. I haven't read the other two yet but certainly plan to (so many good books!). There will eventually be a fourth volume in the series dealing with ethics. 

 

I know I work for Accordance, but I'm telling you personally that the first book is good and I assume the other two are. I don't give books to folks that I wouldn't endorse. 

[ukfraser]

Great, thanks rick, have done an order,

;o)

 

just having problems with the newsletter code

;o(

Edited June 13, 2017 by ukfraser

[Michael Hunt]

Hi Fraser,

I can highly recommend this series and great to see the whole set now in Accordance. (I'll see if I can pump out a mini review sometime in the near future if my workload allows it).

 

The titles can be read individually though there is something to be had by reading them chronologically starting with "Reading Scripture" followed by "Learning Theology" & then "Worshipping with".

 

Reading Scripture is definitely the Church Father's primer and the go to title I would recommend.

 

The second and third titles are more comprehensive treatments of select topics but can easily be read on their own. I do think you would get more value out of them by reading them after Reading Scripture.

 

Worshipping with the Church Fathers would be one I suspect Fraser you would find particularly interesting. Halls own journey into "liturgy" parallels my own. His treatment gives strong support to those who wish to practise something described elsewhere as "Historical Worship". His writing at times is very pastoral and the makes his work on the Fathers easily accessible. He also manages to do this without overly simplifying the work of the Fathers.

 

I'll leave you with this quote from the conclusion on Worshipping with the Fathers

 

 

CONCLUSION

 

____________________

 

 

We have traveled quite a distance with the church fathers in this book. Hopefully by now the landscape of the fathers’ thoughts and practices concerning the sacraments, prayer and spiritual discipline looks more familiar to readers. Perhaps for some travelers a way station has been spotted that looks inviting and worth an extended visit.

Some pilgrims may want to investigate more thoroughly the patristic sacramental worldview. My suggestion is to immerse yourself in the fathers’ own writings. Read primary source material from the fathers to expand your horizons—my chapters on baptism and the Eucharist provide entryways into this primary material.

You might also consider participating in a worship service in the sacramental tradition. For some, this may be an Orthodox or Roman Catholic service. For others, an Anglican service will do. All three sacramental traditions deeply respect the perspectives of the fathers and have significantly drawn on their insights. For some readers, attending a worship service in the sacramental tradition may well put flesh and bones on the fathers’ writings. To cross denominational and sacramental lines will be a big step for some readers—particularly those from an independent church background or Christians in the Baptist and Anabaptist traditions. But how will we ever understand another’s theological and ecclesial world if we refuse to pay them a visit, if only a short one?

 

It’s worth remembering that the incarnation of the eternal Word undergirds all sacramental thought and practice. The Son has become all that we are so that we might become what he is. No, we will never become “God,” but we can be ever more fully formed into the image of the Son—and it is to this deeper spiritual formation that the fathers call us.

So pay your fellow Christians a visit. Watch, listen, ponder, even taste. As we have seen in our discussion of the fathers’ thoughts on baptism and the Eucharist, humble and simple elements such as water, bread and wine can be used by God to communicate graceful wonders to us. Keep your eyes, hearts and minds open to what the Lord may desire to teach you.

Almost two-thirds of Worshiping with the Church Fathers was devoted to an exploration of patristic thoughts and practices concerning prayer: the basics of prayer, the challenge and difficulty of unceasing prayer, and the Lord’s Prayer. Some of the fathers’ ideas and disciplines regarding prayer may have been familiar, at least to some readers. For others, the fathers’ perspectives may have seemed wild, unreasonable, naive, exaggerated, harsh, demanding, legalistic. Some will need to meditate more fully on the fathers’ ideas in relation to prayer before actually practicing what the fathers taught. Others will be ready to begin to practice patristic prayer disciplines in a wise, structured fashion, with the aid of a good coach. It is best to go slow and to exercise patience in two directions: with the church fathers and with ourselves. Embracing new perspectives and learning new skills—particularly in the spiritual life—are hard, not easy steps. Spiritual growth is more like a marathon than a sprint. Recall Jim Houston’s words: “spiritual growth is the slowest of all human movements.” Patience, humility, discernment and prayer will all be required as we interact with our ancient friends.

As you begin to flex your spiritual muscles with the fathers, don’t be hard on yourself if you find their disciplines extremely difficult—even unattainable. Recall that many of the fathers were either monks or came from a monastic background. They had more time to devote to specific disciplines than we normally do. Chrysostom, for instance, spent two years in a cave above Antioch memorizing the New Testament. Very few of us have a call to a monastic vocation or ready access to a community grounded in the fathers’ point of view. We live in a very different world from that of the fathers. The key, I think, is a skilled adaptation of their views to our present context.

Though we live in different worlds and see things through different cultural lenses, our different cultural horizons can lend themselves to comprehension and practice. Yes, from where we stand and live in the twenty-first century, some patristic outlooks and disciplines will remain foreign—even loony—to us. Yet, because the church fathers lived in a time and culture far removed from us, they see things to which we remain blind, just as they have their own cultural and time-bound blind spots. We do not, however, tend to be blind to the same things. Can we trust the church fathers enough to allow patristic clarity to illuminate areas where our modern perspectives and practices—whether we be Baptists, Anglicans, Presbyterians or independent evangelicals—are muddled, fuzzy or even wrongheaded?

Here’s one practical possibility: take a look in the white or yellow pages of your telephone directory and see if there are any monasteries in your area. There are more than you might think. For instance, in Paoli, a short distance from Eastern University where I teach, there is a community of Norbertine monks. Both I and my students have occasionally given them a call, told them we need to go on retreat and been welcomed with open arms. There might well be such a community near you. At least the possibility is worth investigating.

I suggest visiting communities familiar with the fathers because some things can’t be learned well if our learning is limited to reading words on a page. To understand a sacramental worldview, to enter into the church fathers’ thoughts on prayer, to begin to practice one or two of the patristic disciplines, requires a participation that goes beyond reading itself. So let me encourage you to take the next step, intimidating and anxiety-producing as it might be, into another’s world.

For some, this step into a sacramental world will move us beyond our comfort zone. Our visit may well be only temporary. Fine. Even if our visit is short and limited, try not to judge too quickly. Be as open and receptive as possible. And welcome whatever seems to reflect the mind of Christ as given to us in apostolic revelation, adapting any new possibilities to the providential realities of your own life situation. Monks had the time to pray for hours on end. Young mothers don’t. So be it.

I close Worshiping with the Church Fathers with the realization that our journey is not yet complete. For the fathers indissolubly connected worship with the ethical challenges that faced the ancient Christian day in and day out. In a word, the fathers believed that right and reverent worship fostered holy living, lives filled with the love and grace of Christ.

Not surprisingly, the ethical issues facing the fathers are not entirely foreign to the moral challenges confronting Christians in the twenty-first century: what is our responsibility as Christ’s disciples to the poor, the widow, the orphan, the disenfranchised? How is Jesus’ exhortation to not resist an evil person to be applied to questions of military service (cf. Mt 5:38–42) and other contexts? Did early Christians serve in the military? Why or why not? What did the fathers have to say about issues of human sexuality, marriage and the family, and abortion? Issues such as these, so hotly debated in the present time, were also of extreme importance to ancient Christians. And so, in the fourth volume in this series on the church fathers’ lives and perspectives, we will closely examine their thoughts on living well in the inescapable presence of the Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

 

Hall, Christopher A. Worshiping with the Church Fathers. 1.1. Downers Grove: InterVarsity Press, 2009.

 

accord://read/Fathers-Worship#1151

Edited June 14, 2017 by Michael Hunt

[ukfraser]

Many thanks michael, bought last night. You are quite correct, it was the worshipping one which first alerted me to the series but i was also intrigued by the theology one.

 

I already have quite a lot on the fathers as have been stuck in a 'creeds' rut for a few years now but got 'reading' as the male 'must have a set' thing kicked in after rick's response.

 

Will take your advice and go through them chronologically.

 

Reading the author's comments, I wonder when volume 4 will be finished. (Reminds me of h2g2).

 

;o)

Edited June 14, 2017 by ukfraser