Daniel Francis Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 The quality of his other works it amazes me the unattributed citations were not corrected rather than removing them. Cause like you I feel it was an oversight and not intentional. I know I had one teacher in Junior high who insisted on attributing a favourite edison quote to Albert Einstein (who may have used the quote as well), but even when confronted with an Encyclopaedia article showing that at least Edison said it first he refused to stop attributing it to Einstein (I use him as an example of one not willing to acknowledge error). O' Brien acknowledged his mistake and apologized for it. I have mentioned ideas (not academic circles of course) and in the back of my mind thinking is this my thought or another's. Thankfully no one in a casual discussion is going to say that is X's words but when something is rattling around your head we can forget it's source or as we formulate our thoughts can unintentionally draw on what we have read or even simply heard. I am not saying the works did not need repairing just it was a shame to throw out good works that just needed some repair. -dan 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diatheke76 Posted August 17, 2017 Share Posted August 17, 2017 Well said Dan! It should've been edited and updated for corrections instead of throwing away hours of work to the trash. Oh well! It is what it is. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michel Gilbert Posted August 18, 2017 Share Posted August 18, 2017 (edited) Not to start a firestorm, but since I've seen this on the Forums before, I have to disagree. Just like a doctor (physician) first does no harm, a doctor (Ph.D.) first does not plagiarize - copy another's work and present it is their own. I don't know the specifics in this case. But plagiarism by an academic is inexcusable. Should/does Acc forgive anyone who breaks copyright laws, i.e., copies things they didn't buy? It is sort of like plagiarism, copying another's work, but not like plagiarism, because the copier isn't presenting it as his/her own work. In fact, I think breaking copyright law is the lesser offence of the two. I have been plagiarized, and my book has been copied - it is (or at least was last time I checked) free on Scribd, even though I didn't give my permission. But of the two, plagiarism hurts more - especially emotionally. It feels like a complete violation, like a physician doing harm. Edit: In this fury of emotion, I just realized that "forgive" was not the best word choice. Of course I forgave the person who plagiarized me, and it has remained a private matter. I mean, should/does Acc let a copyright violation slide, and do nothing about it? And let the person keep that copyrighted work? Edited August 18, 2017 by Michel Gilbert 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Francis Posted August 18, 2017 Share Posted August 18, 2017 Michel, I never meant deliberate plagiarism should in anyway be excused. But I am working n the principle he told the truth that he never did intentionally. We who bought the works no longer for sale were allowed to keep them. I don't know the answer and Indeed maybe the best option was made. -dan 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michel Gilbert Posted August 18, 2017 Share Posted August 18, 2017 I just wanted to give another perspective, one I’m sure many aren’t familiar with. I was reading something by another author, and then started reading my own words, word for word. It was one of the most sickening feelings I have ever had, a personal and professional violation. Some of the discussions about this topic struck a nerve in me; it still feels like a fresh wound. Plagiarism is an actual crime, with an actual victim, just like with copyright violations.An example might be someone plagiarized the deed to your farm, put their name on it, and demanded their property. What if they actually took residence while you were away, and they had the farm (possession is 9/10 of the law), and the deed? Should they be allowed to keep it? How would you feel? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Julia Falling Posted August 18, 2017 Share Posted August 18, 2017 Edit: In this fury of emotion, I just realized that "forgive" was not the best word choice. Of course I forgave the person who plagiarized me, and it has remained a private matter. I mean, should/does Acc let a copyright violation slide, and do nothing about it? And let the person keep that copyrighted work? Michel – If someone had purchased a hard copy of a commentary that is not longer sold by a publisher, he would be able to keep it. In like manner, those of us who purchased an electronic copy can keep ours. It was the publisher who pulled the questionable volumes, no longer permitting the sale of either hard copy or electronic copy. What they did was right. Accordance responded, as they should, honoring the license agreement with the publisher. That was all as it should be. We have at least one on the forums who took classes under Dr. O'Brien and thinks the missing citations were an oversight, not a deliberate taking of credit for the work of another. Dr. O'Brien responded with an apology and taking of responsibility. He made no excuses. I think his response showed integrity. People do make honest mistakes. In Dr. O'Brien's case, I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt. The deliberate taking of an entire book and sale of the stolen work is theft and should be prosecuted. There is no way the one who took your book and put it up for sale could have done what he did accidentally, or as an honest mistake. Is there no legal protection for you? Did the one who took your book put his name on it? It's awful. I'm truly sorry for what happened to you. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Francis Posted August 18, 2017 Share Posted August 18, 2017 (edited) No I never meant to imply it was a victimless crime... or harmless.... The person plagiarized should be compensated too of course... I have known of cattle rustlers and people who steal grain too... I have not been victim of either but known the victims of both. -dan PS:I have had stuff in the past stolen from a garden always felt in that case that they likely needed it more than me, was definitely not doing well financially then, but they may have needed it more than me. Edited August 18, 2017 by Daniel Francis Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michel Gilbert Posted August 18, 2017 Share Posted August 18, 2017 Hi,This is just my perspective, not my argument. That would take a whole book.There have been other cases like this, plagiarism on such a scale that a publisher pulls it out of circulation. I throw such books out. I feel I am in possession of stolen property.It seems like a waste of time, money, and energy to pursue Scribd from my tiny homestead in rural Canada.There is violation, and there is forgiveness.Regards,Michel Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R. Mansfield Posted August 21, 2017 Author Share Posted August 21, 2017 Last chance for NIGTC for the Accordance Bible Software Library for only $150--sale ends at midnight EDT tonight! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miguel1981 Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 Just purchased myself and greatly pleased so far with John and Luke's gospel 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Francis Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 John's gospel isn't in the 13 volumes though???? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Diatheke76 Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 (edited) John's gospel isn't in the 13 volumes though???? Maybe John Nolland on Matthew Edited August 21, 2017 by Diatheke76 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daniel Francis Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 Guess that makes sense.... I had at first thought he might have meant the letters of John but they are not there either... -dan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
miguel1981 Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 Woops! I misunderstood for this morning i was referencing both gospels but Johns was Murray's from the WBC commentary and Luke by Marshall from the NIGTC. But either way they ware both good and not disappointed by Marshall on Luke. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alistair Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 I agree about the transliteration – don't want it and don't need it. Wish Pillar hadn't done it. Glad WBC didn't. In this vein, don't get me started on the occasions when publishers try to give a pronunciation guide that looks like it was written by children. For example, "dictionary (dick-shun-AIR-ee)." I think it makes a scholarly work appear amateurish. If a publisher insists on a pronunciation guide, then use the International Phonetic Alphabet. I've noticed that it appears to be only American publishers who are guilty of this; I have not seen this in any British books that I can remember. Does anyone know the origin of this? Is there a standard source for these pronunciation guides? (And please spare us the comments about the superiority of the British educational system, thank you!) 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ιακοβ Posted August 21, 2017 Share Posted August 21, 2017 It seems like a waste of time, money, and energy to pursue Scribd from my tiny homestead in rural Canada. Just wondering, did you not fill out a DCMA form and send it to Scribd, or, you did fill out a DCMA and Scribd ignored it? Im surprised, most companies seem to act upon all DCMA requests without even investigating the legitimacy of said DCMA request due to lack of time/resources. So it is odd that Scribd would not take down material identified on a DCMA form. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michel Gilbert Posted August 22, 2017 Share Posted August 22, 2017 Hi Ιακοβ, I sent you a pm to answer your question. And to return to the original post, I did buy the NIGTC. Thanks Eerdmans and Accordance. Regards, Michel 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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