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#1 mgvh

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Posted 19 August 2017 - 11:37 PM

I am finding it very difficult in Accordance to conduct the searches in the LXX I regularly do.

  1. If I want to search all the instances of something in the LXX (Rahlf's), it appears that I need to conduct separate searches on the regular text and the alternate texts. I want to be able to conduct a single search and find all instances in both.
  2. I regularly conduct searches where I want to find instances in both the LXX and the GNT. I appreciate having the "Greek Bible (LXX + GNT)" in Accordance, but it is of limited value.
    • The LXX text is that of Swete. (It is nice to have access to Swete's even w/out the apparatus. I see that I can upgrade to get the apparatus.) The GNT is Westcott and Hort. So, this will give me LXX/NT results, but I will have to cross check them with Rahlf's and NA28 every time.
    • The Swete LXX has a different chapter:verse system than Rahlf's which is the standard, so that means all results also have to be cross checked in order to get standard LXX versification. (I can do this by adding LXX Rahlf's as a parallel, but it's an extra step and onerous when there are many results.)
    • While Westcott-Hort is close to the NA28, most scholarly research assumes use of NA28.
  3. As with the limitation of searching Rahlf's, the Accordance "Greek Bible" does not include any of the alternate texts (labelled "parallel" texts in Accordance for Rahlf's and NETS), so that means any search of the "Greek Bible" (using Swete) must be accompanied by an additional search of the parallel texts in Rahlfs.

I'm frustrated because I'm trying to switch over to Accordance, and these are tasks I can accomplish quickly and easily in BibleWorks and Logos. BibleWorks actually has the best solution. They have created a separate text that is composed of Rahlf's LXX plus the alternate texts plus NA28. One search does it all. Logos allows users to create "collections" of texts, so one can bundle together whatever they want. (And so I have a collection made up of Rahlf's LXX plus the alternate texts plus NA28. Logos has issues in graphing results using collections, however.)

 

SO:

  • If there is a way for Accordance users to combine texts, I can't find it. If there is, someone please tell me how. If there isn't, then this is a feature request.
  • If texts can't be combined by users, then it would be good if Accordance created a new combination text consisting of texts we already have in the Greek and Hebrew Explorer: LXX Rahlf's plus the parallel texts plus NA28.

Perhaps I'm missing something. I checked, but I don't see any upgrade path to accomplishing what I want to do.

 

Thanks for any assistance!



#2 דָנִיאֶל

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Posted Yesterday, 12:54 AM

The best I can suggest is to create your own Group containing the texts you want. I created one with Rahlfs, EPT, F35 and NA28. Then do a Greek Research query.

This can even be used with constructs which I didn't know until I tried it. So I was able to search for αγαπη  and αυτος within 2 words of each other for example.

 

Is this what you are looking for ?

 

This search :

 

Attached File  groupConstruct.JPG   22.08KB   0 downloads

 

returned :

 

LXX1

Eccl. 9:6      καί γε ἀγάπη αὐτῶν καί γε μῖσος αὐτῶν
 …

Wis. 3:9 … καὶ οἱ πιστοὶ ἐν ἀγάπῃ προσμενοῦσιν αὐτῷ·
    ὅτι χάρις καὶ ἔλεος …


GNT-EPT

Eph. 2:4 … διὰ τὴν πολλὴν ἀγάπην αὐτοῦ ἣν ἠγάπησεν ἡμᾶς,

Col. 1:13 … βασιλείαν τοῦ υἱοῦ τῆς ἀγάπης αὐτοῦ,

1John 4:12 … ἐν ἡμῖν μένει καὶ ἡ ἀγάπη αὐτοῦ τετελειωμένη ἐστὶν ἐν ἡμῖν.


GNT-F35

Eph. 2:4 … διὰ τὴν πολλὴν ἀγάπην αὐτοῦ ἣν ἠγάπησεν ἡμᾶς,

Col. 1:13 … βασιλείαν τοῦ υἱοῦ τῆς ἀγάπης αὐτοῦ,

1John 4:12 … ἐν ἡμῖν μένει καὶ ἡ ἀγάπη αὐτοῦ τετελειωμένη ἐστὶν ἐν ἡμῖν.


GNT28-T

Eph. 2:4 … διὰ τὴν πολλὴν ἀγάπην αὐτοῦ ἣν ἠγάπησεν ἡμᾶς,

Col. 1:13 … βασιλείαν τοῦ υἱοῦ τῆς ἀγάπης αὐτοῦ,

1John 4:12 … ἐν ἡμῖν μένει καὶ ἡ ἀγάπη αὐτοῦ ἐν ἡμῖν τετελειωμένη …


as an example.

 

Thx

D


Sola lingua bona est lingua mortua

ἡ μόνη ἀγαθὴ γλῶσσα γλῶσσα νεκρὰ ἐστιν

lišanu ēdēnitu damqitu lišanu mītu

 

"Du stammst vom Herrn Adam und der Herrin Eva ab", sagte Aslan. "Und das ist zugleich Ehre genug, um das Häupt des ärmsten Bettlers zu erheben, und genug, um die Schultern des größten Kaisers auf Erden zu beugen. Sei zufrieden." Aslan, Die Chroniken von Narnia, Prinz Kaspian von Narnia. CS Lewis. Übersetzt von Wolfgang Holbein und Christian Rendel.

 

Accordance Configurations :
 
Mac : 2009 27" iMac                 Windows : HP 4540s laptop
      Intel Core Duo                          Intel i5 Ivy Bridge
      12GB RAM                                8GB RAM
      Accordance 11.2.4 and 12                Accordance 11.1.6 and 12
      OSX 10.11 (Yosemite)                    Win 10 Professional x64


#3 Ken Simpson

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Posted Yesterday, 01:36 AM

Hi mgvh

 

try adding and independent pane and using the LINK command.

 

That will perform the one search on both texts simultaneously.

 

Attached File  Screen Shot 2017-08-20 at 16.34.29 .png   518.94KB   1 downloads

 

Don’t open it in parallel - open it as an independent pane.


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#4 mgvh

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Posted Yesterday, 02:29 PM

Thank you, Daniel. You got me on the right track. I was trying to figure out how to "group" texts. I now see that the way to do so is via a new Research tab and then use the Add texts and choose whatever I want. (You seem to suggest that there is a way to group texts outside the Research pane. True? If so, how?)

So, for my purposes, I created a Research group of LXX Rahlf's, LXX Rahlf's parallel texts, and GNT NA28. Run my construct search and all is good!

The only limitation appears to be that Analytics for Research results only include Hits Graph, Analysis Graph, Bar Chart, and Pie Chart. (I'd like the Table List and Chart, but the Hits Graph essentially shows what I want.)

Ken, I see what you're getting at. I would open tabs for each text (LXX Rahlfs, LXX Rahlfs parallels, GNT NA28), then LINK each one to my Construct. Running search generates hits in each text tab, but I am not able to display all results on a single graph. I tried putting all 3 texts into a single tab, then LINKing my Construct to that tab, but it only seems to search on the first text in the tab.

Thanks again. This helps!



#5 דָנִיאֶל

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Posted Yesterday, 02:51 PM

Hey ya,

 

  The groups are actually created in the library not in the Research, but they are then used for Research. At least that's how I do it, and I'm not aware of another way. You can see the group in the library by opening the library and looking "My Stuff" and then "My Groups".

 

  Once you have your basic research results you can click through to each text individually to examine in detail.

 

Thx

D


Sola lingua bona est lingua mortua

ἡ μόνη ἀγαθὴ γλῶσσα γλῶσσα νεκρὰ ἐστιν

lišanu ēdēnitu damqitu lišanu mītu

 

"Du stammst vom Herrn Adam und der Herrin Eva ab", sagte Aslan. "Und das ist zugleich Ehre genug, um das Häupt des ärmsten Bettlers zu erheben, und genug, um die Schultern des größten Kaisers auf Erden zu beugen. Sei zufrieden." Aslan, Die Chroniken von Narnia, Prinz Kaspian von Narnia. CS Lewis. Übersetzt von Wolfgang Holbein und Christian Rendel.

 

Accordance Configurations :
 
Mac : 2009 27" iMac                 Windows : HP 4540s laptop
      Intel Core Duo                          Intel i5 Ivy Bridge
      12GB RAM                                8GB RAM
      Accordance 11.2.4 and 12                Accordance 11.1.6 and 12
      OSX 10.11 (Yosemite)                    Win 10 Professional x64


#6 mgvh

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Posted Yesterday, 03:41 PM

Daniel: Even better! Thanks. I'm still learning, but I now see how to create new groups of texts. When I open the group of LXX Rahlf's + parallels + NA28, it opens the texts in 3 tabs. I can open my construct search, link to each tab, and run the search. (This is like what Ken suggested.) Results show up in each tab.

To get all the results to show up in a single tab (and thus appear on a single hits graph), I open a Research tab, choose my text group, select Greek as the search language, open my construct, link to the Research tab, and go.


Edited by mgvh, Yesterday, 04:04 PM.


#7 דָנִיאֶל

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Posted Yesterday, 04:09 PM

That's really odd. Mine doesn't. What version are you using ? If you have a test case that would be interesting.

 I've just done what you describe above and it's working fine for me.

 

I don't think I've ever used the custom research group stuff. I assume it's just to create a one off query group that you may not want to keep. Or to prototype one before turning it into a User Group.

 

Thx

D


Sola lingua bona est lingua mortua

ἡ μόνη ἀγαθὴ γλῶσσα γλῶσσα νεκρὰ ἐστιν

lišanu ēdēnitu damqitu lišanu mītu

 

"Du stammst vom Herrn Adam und der Herrin Eva ab", sagte Aslan. "Und das ist zugleich Ehre genug, um das Häupt des ärmsten Bettlers zu erheben, und genug, um die Schultern des größten Kaisers auf Erden zu beugen. Sei zufrieden." Aslan, Die Chroniken von Narnia, Prinz Kaspian von Narnia. CS Lewis. Übersetzt von Wolfgang Holbein und Christian Rendel.

 

Accordance Configurations :
 
Mac : 2009 27" iMac                 Windows : HP 4540s laptop
      Intel Core Duo                          Intel i5 Ivy Bridge
      12GB RAM                                8GB RAM
      Accordance 11.2.4 and 12                Accordance 11.1.6 and 12
      OSX 10.11 (Yosemite)                    Win 10 Professional x64


#8 mgvh

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Posted Yesterday, 08:52 PM

I'm looking for εγενετο εν τῳ Infinitive constructions. What I want my students to see is that Luke uses it almost exclusively in the NT, but that in doing so he is imitating LXX style picking up the underlying Hebrew. (I think he's trying to make his gospel sound more 'bilbisch'!)

I've attached the Construct file I've been using. See what you get!

Attached Files


Edited by mgvh, Yesterday, 08:53 PM.


#9 דָנִיאֶל

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Posted Today, 12:45 AM

Worked ok for me on the user group.

Philo and Athanasius show this construction, though I think Ath. is quoting Luke actually - also a few hits in the Pseudepigrapha. But granted the predominate place is NT Luke and LXX.

 

Thx

D


Sola lingua bona est lingua mortua

ἡ μόνη ἀγαθὴ γλῶσσα γλῶσσα νεκρὰ ἐστιν

lišanu ēdēnitu damqitu lišanu mītu

 

"Du stammst vom Herrn Adam und der Herrin Eva ab", sagte Aslan. "Und das ist zugleich Ehre genug, um das Häupt des ärmsten Bettlers zu erheben, und genug, um die Schultern des größten Kaisers auf Erden zu beugen. Sei zufrieden." Aslan, Die Chroniken von Narnia, Prinz Kaspian von Narnia. CS Lewis. Übersetzt von Wolfgang Holbein und Christian Rendel.

 

Accordance Configurations :
 
Mac : 2009 27" iMac                 Windows : HP 4540s laptop
      Intel Core Duo                          Intel i5 Ivy Bridge
      12GB RAM                                8GB RAM
      Accordance 11.2.4 and 12                Accordance 11.1.6 and 12
      OSX 10.11 (Yosemite)                    Win 10 Professional x64





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