The best mobile platform for Accordance?

[TCanji]

Greetings to all iPad and tablet users out there!

 

Thus far, I’m using Accordance exlusivley on Mac OS and would really like to start using it on a mobile platform as well. Which platform would you suggest: iOS, Windows (tablet) or Android? I do admit that yesterday I downloaded Acc. for Android on my Lenovo phone with Android 6 OS and what I’ve seen did not impress at all.  A very cumbersome experience indeed, missing A LOT of functionality compared to full Mac Os version, but I’m sure it will improve over time? Honestly IMHO it looks more like not yet ready for a public release, a kind of a improved “Beta version”. I might be totally wrong here - if so, I do apologize - but does anybody else share my disapointment or …. possibly my expectations were not realistic and just a tad to high? On the other hand, I do publicly want to offer a big Thank You to Developers in the Android department for their had work!

 

A kind of disclaimer: apart from my short and “taken by surprise experience” with Android version yesterday, I have never seen Accordance in action on any other platform apart on Mac OS, let alone mobile. Yes, it’s true, guilty as charged! So please, do not judge harshly   . Therefore - in my own defense - this Acc. for Android just might be working swell and I just could not tell ?! 

 

There remain three additional questions:

 

1. Has iOS been fully developed as to replicate Mac OS experience? If not will it ever have all the functionality as Mac OS?

2. Is Windows platform still the best option when compared to Mac OS functionality? 

3. Lastly, what wold be the basic hardware on all three mobile platforms in order for Accordance to work smoothly?

 

 

Thank you in advance for your time and response.

[ukfraser]

1) no and no.

 

2 yes and not sure, still prefer Mac OS over windows but windows is far better than mobile. I think the Dr. J podcast will give you a better feeling.

 

But it so depends what you want to do and use. For example Accordance atlas and timeline are unlikely to ever be on mobile. So if you need them it rules mobile out.

 

I use the iPad virtually all the time, it is light and easy to hold in the hand and I like the way the pro changes colour for reading at night. Therefore I wouldn’t want a windows tablet. I find the iPad easier to read than a book.

 

You have an android phone, how do you get on with it? I like the way my iphone, iPad and mbp all talk together so I stick with iPad and moved away from an android phone.

 

The iPad has severe limitations, you can have a text and either another text, a commentary or other ‘reference tool’ eg bible notes, study bible or a devotional beside it and switching between them is easy. You also have brilliant interlinear. However, if you want to look at a dictionary, a writing, an atlas or anything else, it’s mega clunky to get to, mega clunky to change resource and you are only allowed one item open at a time and not when a text is open (text being a bible in English, Spanish, Hebrew, greek etc). Though you do have an Instant Details equivalent with all the linking.

 

For example you can’t have the following:

It’s a pain with the original expositors bible commentary as that has the commentary and notes in two files so you can’t have them open at the same time.

It’s a pain if you want an atlas open next to a bible passage.

It’s a pain if you want a greek lexicon or grammar open next to a greek nt.

 

Main restriction is number of items open and the combination though this could change with tabs but is never likely to be the same as the full fat version.

 

You get used to it and for me, it is enough and I wouldn’t want to be without ios mobile and the convenience of the iPad for me far outweighs the weight and fully fledged functionality of a windows tablet. I am just very frustrated that the obvious clunkiness hasn’t been removed as the coding has obviously been done and implemented for some parts of the iOS program and Feel it should have been implemented consistently throughout. But I am very grateful to have my Accordance Library with me on my mobile devices and appreciative of the app.

 

Plus do you need the extra capability of a computer?

Would you want to take a windows tablet to a bible study for example?

 

If you go down ios, I think the 10.5 ipad is ideal for prolonged hand hold reading and seeing things comfortably and I went for the largest storage available as I have a very large 105 gig iTunes music library. Though Accordance takes about 4 gig and i have a learner library with a few image and sound rich content as well as a couple of commentary sets etc.

Edited February 7, 2018 by ukfraser

[Λύχνις Δαν]

Hi Tomi,

 

  You will get a lot of opinions on this one I'm sure and there a many things to consider.

 

  First, to your question about the Android app. It went live in version 1.0 late last week. It is being enhanced with a lot of nice new features as we speak. Regarding its maturity, it is hard to convey adequately how much work must go into booting up development on a new platform, how much must be done to port software from one environment to another and make it work naturally in the new one and so on. I work on software that runs on multiple platforms and they are more similar than Windows/OSX is to iOS/Android, and still there are countless small things to consider. So the Android port is young, much has been done, much remains.

 

  Secondly, I rather doubt the true mobile apps will ever have the full function of the desktop apps, FOR deployments where they are are running with small screen touch interfaces. There just isn't the real estate to make some stuff work well, particularly on phones. The processing power is there but the mode of interaction is different and in particular the available real estate is often not there. Now, I do think it is possible for the app to offer all function, theoretically, of the desktop if attached to external devices - eg. Samsung DEX like things or Razor's laptop dock. But that environment is even less standardized that the mobile platform itself. So developers are unlikely to jump on it any time soon.

 

  Windows tablets can run the full desktop app if you get a full Windows version on it, rather than something like RT, if that's even still available. And these tablets would tend to suggest that the above argument is not without its counterarguments, but I'm not sure how well desktop apps with complex interfaces really work on such devices.

 

  I have never owned an iPad or Mac laptop so I cannot comment on that experience. I have a Mac desktop.

 

  If by question 2 you are asking is Windows the best full function alternative to Mac I would say yes. As I said above, I doubt the true mobile apps will compare with that. The iOS app has been constantly enhanced since its release and still there are features that the desktop app offers that it does not. But it meets the needs of a good number of use cases. I expect the same to be true of Android but the Android app is newer and so at present has fewer features. And of course the desktop developers keep adding features !

 

  As to question 3, the Android app will run on pretty 5.0 of Android and above. You experience will vary from platform to platform vis a vis performance, ability to attach to external peripherals, SD card use and such like. But it will run. BTW, you say three mobile platforms but I don't know what the third one is. If you mean Windows on a tablet device like Surface Pro then it will just run the desktop app. I've never played with that configuration so others will have to comment, but there you would be running the desktop app on a smaller screen device. How well that works for people I don't know but I've not heard people complaining that it's terrible. And yes this would be the only mobile experience where you have the full desktop app.

 

Thx

D

[R. Mansfield]

Tomi,

 

This is a great discussion. Thanks for bringing it up. You've already got some good responses above, but let me say a couple of things...

 

First, the closest equivalent on a tablet to what you're already experiencing on the Mac will be found in a Windows tablet. I strongly recommend you get one with active/digital stylus support for when you truly want to use it in a mobile setting. Our Windows version of Accordance is not designed as a touch-centric/mobile app, but it is "touch friendly." That means you can scroll text with your fingers, tap buttons, etc. But to get the equivalent of mouseover features like crossover highlighting and Instant Details for hyperlinks, an active stylus replicates a mouse's functions quite well.

 

As has already been mentioned above, the Accordance Mobile app for Android is very new and does not have all the features of the iOS version, but they're coming. And I would not necessarily count out any specific feature in Accordance for Mac and Windows as appearing one day in our mobile apps. Some features, such as the Atlas or Timeline, will be more challenging; but to my knowledge, nothing has a "never" stamp on it. 

 

Finally, all four of these platforms continue to be in active development. New features will continue to appear in all of them, although don't be surprised if you don't see from us renewed energy in the mobile apps like you've never seen before. 

 

Stay tuned--great things are coming!

[TCanji]

UK Fraser,

Thank you so much for your elaborate answer, appreciate everything your shared.

To answer some of your questions:

1. I’m very much used to - as you say - “the full fat version", so I’m “spoiled” by Acc. capabilities on my Mac and would hardly trade it for something much less functional. I’m very much aware of the compromise and if I want to go mobile I should learn to live with it. In that regard I very much appreciate your own words: "the convenience of the iPad for me far outweighs the weight and fully fledged functionality of a windows tablet".

2. I have Accord. on my Mac mini (2010) and MBAir (2012) and definitively love syncing via Dropbox. I predominantly use my MBAir while I preach, but would love to be …well, more mobile! I’m itching to buy a Windows 2 in 1 tablet because of a full fledged functionality and would extreemly appreciate hearing more on the subject from other Forum members that do have first hand experience with Win. tablet + I’m a little worried that Dropbox syncing won’t work between a Mac and a Win. tablet ?!

3. I do have Android phone, but using Acc. on it by what I’ve seen so far is not an option for me.

4. I definitively agree with you that having all on Mac is a breeze and a joy to use, I may start with a second hand iPad and see for myself … hopefully 10.5 Pro, but I might have to wait a bit more for that iPad to "materialize"

5. Thanks for pinpointing the iPad limitations as well. Appreciate that.

[TCanji]

דָנִיאֶל and Rick,

Just saw your response - great answers from both of you - very helpful, thank you!

@ Daniel, regarding my Q # 2 yes, I did have in mind a Win. tablet, so you are right there are only two real mobile versions, since Acc. on a Win. tablet is still a fully fledged Acc. app. Thanks for all of your words of wisdom.

@ Rick, appreciate your feedback. Yes, my hope is buying a Win. tablet with a stylus - thanks for the encouragement. Also, could you please comment on possibility of syncing via Dropbox between Mac and Win.? Thanks.

[R. Mansfield]

Also, could you please comment on possibility of syncing via Dropbox between Mac and Win?

 

It should work fine for you to sync User Notes, User Tools, Highlights, Bookmarks, Stacks, Papers, Places, and Current Session.

[Michel Gilbert]

Hi Tomi,

 

A lot of good stuff has been said already. 

 

In my opinion, a mobile device has a flat touch screen, or one that can be made flat. So, I consider 2in1s mobile devices. 

 

I am always searching for the one device to rule them all - a mobile device that I can use everywhere that I can attach a monitor, keyboard, and mouse to when I want. I love OSX, but it doesn't have touch for one of my most important programs. I also don't like many things about Windows, but I need it for some programs. And there are limitations to Acc in iOS and Android, some already mentioned. 

 

So, here is what I would do today: I would buy a 13" 2in1 touch screen that is upgradable to 16 GB RAM, and get a pen with it. Most wouldn't do this, but I would install Linux on it, and install Windows in VMWare (it also doesn't cost anything extra to do this). I would then install Acc in Windows. I would also install Android in the Windows VM for another essential app. Finally, I would use remote desktop software to access my Mac desktop. But I would also keep my iPad mini, using it for reading in Acc, Kindle, and in about 10 other apps - pdf apps, Logos, Mellel, Scrivener, etc. 

 

If the Construct Search came to Android, I would probably replace my iPad with an Android tablet. I hope it is one of the great things Rick is referring to.

 

Of course, if you have the money, you could just get a Modbook.

 

Regards,

 

Michel

[TCanji]

It should work fine for you to sync User Notes, User Tools, Highlights, Bookmarks, Stacks, Papers, Places, and Current Session.

 

Thanks Rick, great to hear!

 

 

Edited February 7, 2018 by Tomi

[TCanji]

It should work fine for you to sync User Notes, User Tools, Highlights, Bookmarks, Stacks, Papers, Places, and Current Session.

 

Thanks Rick, great to hear!

[Λύχνις Δαν]

 

Of course, if you have the money, you could just get a Modbook.

 

Regards,

 

Michel

 

Nice looking piece of kit but you would really have to want one

[TCanji]

Hi Michel,

 

Thank you for your response - a rather fine thinking "outside the box" - appreciate it!

[Michel Gilbert]

Hi again.

 

I had Ubuntu on a 17" non-touch laptop, with Acc in VMWare, and it worked great. It wasn't very mobile, but it gave me the idea for my next linux box. 

 

Of course I'm not suggesting that you get a 13" screen, that is personal preference. I just wanted to say I think Acc on a Windows tablet is a good idea, but you need a pen like Rick suggested. It is just my personal preference to keep Windows under control in a VM.

[ukfraser]

Tomi, Can i suggest you need to really think about what you want this device for, particularly whether to support your Mac mini or air or replace as well as think about what else you want to use them for.

 

Then Go into a store and spend quality time holding, sitting, reading, working with them.

 

I was all set to get a windows tablet till I actually held it for a few minutes. Now I quickly get off the iPad 2 when I’m at my daughters, (my original one I passed on to her) as I’m so used to the lightness of the pro. But I’ve just been using the mbp at a desk doing some serious prolonged stuff on lightroom which i would never attempt on the iPad.

 

The three tools you are considering all have very different strengths and weaknesses as well as different development cycles and product maturity and associated apps. I can’t imagine life without forScore and there really isn’t an equivalent on windows. But I do miss Visio or msaccess on Mac or increasing storage on an iPad both of which would be an option on a windows tablet.

[Ιακοβ]

But it so depends what you want to do and use. For example Accordance atlas and timeline are unlikely to ever be on mobile. So if you need them it rules mobile out.

 

I had to chime in on this. Prior to the invention of the iPhone (and perhaps its related predecessors), no one truly ever imagined the sorts of things that could be done on a computer would be done on a phone.  Fast forward 10 years, and I am convinced that the ability to navigate maps/locations through various points of history, and the ability to communicate historical timelines through a mobile type interface will be common. Furthermore, at minimum, it will become possible to use glasses to explore in real time a 3D VR simulation of the various places on a map, I expect it would be possible to "enter a room" and literally see a timeline around you. 

 

https://www.microsoft.com/en-au/hololens

[TCanji]

Thanks to everyone for their valuable input.

@ Michel - never used Linux but thanks for encouragement, glad to hear of your own positive experience.

@ ukfraser - thanks again for your down-to-earth thinking and pointing me to a right direction, namely taking time evaluating pros and cons before making my definite decision.

@ Ιακοβ  - thanks for expanding our imagination
 

* BTW, what would be the bare minimum requirements for running Accordance on a PC Win. machine - hardware and software vise -  just for fun so I can get some real feedback and compare how it stacks against my Mac experience ... before I possibly jump to a more mobile Win. tablet solution? Thanks!

[Λύχνις Δαν]

These days with Windows I generally want a machine with 16GB RAM minimum and no less than i5 processor in the Intel range or whatever the AMD equivalent would be, which I'm not really sure of. I would use an SSD if I could. This isn't required for Accordance but just in general for the sort of stuff I use. I would not kit a machine with less than 8GB RAM these days though. And if I got only 8 I would want it to be expandable beyond that. To a point raised earlier, I think by Fraser, consider carefully what you want the machine to be able to do. It won't just be Accordance in the end I think.

 

You can run Accordance on much less capable kit than I suggest above though. Accordance's website does not so far as I can tell specify a minimum hardware spec. I suspect the answer is the minimum is whatever you can run the OS on. Here is Microsoft's spec page for Win 10 https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/windows-10-specifications. I surprised actually to see only 2GB RAM being suggested but ... it is a minimum. I would not expect that to perform well. Accordance itself does not require Windows 10 https://www.accordancebible.com/Accordance-For-Windows but everything else is basically unsupported now by Microsoft, so I would get Win 10 on anything new.

 

Thx

D

[William B]

I use accordance on the following -

 

For primary research I use my windows laptop, accordance runs fine there.

 

For any secondary research I use my iPad, or now, my Samsung phone. Both are able to do the basics through naturally at this point the iOS version is more advanced. I am pleased I can now access my accordance resources on my phone again. I can’t go back to an iPhone, Samsung works better for me as I rely on group emails which it does natively...so iPhone is out now.

[Michel Gilbert]

. . . what would be the bare minimum requirements for running Accordance on a PC Win. machine 

 

 

Hi Tomi,

 

I ran Acc on a W10 tablet, 2 GB RAM, Atom 2760, and Acc worked well for reading with a lexicon, and construct searches. But now I would get 4 GB as a minimum, and at least expandable to 8. I agree with Daniel, that you will probably use it for more and more as time goes on, and if that happens, you will eventually need 8 GB. 

 

But if you really going to use a Win tablet for just one program, Accordance, I can tell you I'm running W10 in VMWare on my Mac mini with 3 GB RAM to run BibleWorks, and it runs great. But I uninstalled every program I could, disabled Cortana in the registry, and stopped indexing. It really is just for one program.

 

Regards,

 

Michel

[Helen Brown]

Accordance does not have heavy requirements. It will run on any new device you get, and most that are up to 5 years old. The actual system requirements are available.

[Daniel Francis]

The only caveat of concern I have if you go used tablet, do beware that certain earlier generations of MS Surface Pro did get incredibly HOT... Not bursting into flames danger but I had heard of more than one person getting rid of theirs because they found it too hot to hold comfortably (ironically enough being one seemingly cooler blooded I'd likely enjoy it).

 

-dan

Edited February 8, 2018 by Daniel Francis

[TCanji]

Thanks everyone!

 

I really appreciate all of your responses, kind advise and words of wisdom!

Thank you so much for your help, I truly appreciate it.

 

In this quest of mine a verse from Proverbs comes to mind, Prov.24:6 from NKJV and JPS respectively:

 

“... in a multitude of counselors there is safety” (NKJV) + "... victory comes with much planning" (JPS)

 

So, thank you for helping me be more "safe in my planning" !